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Tipping.
https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=20786		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  johnacraft [ Mon Jun 12, 2006 1:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Tipping.
A few friends and I are having an email exchange about tipping as it relates to railroad crews. I'm curious to find out how folks here who are in train or engine service view the following hypothetical scenarios:


1. You are the engineer on a steam locomotive on a regular tourist train. (For argument's sake, pretend it's the daily 9:00 train from Durango to Silverton and return.) At the end of the trip, while the passengers are detraining, one of them approaches the cab and offers you a tip.

What would go through your mind? And would you accept the tip?


2. You are the fireman on a photo special that I've organized. You got up at before dawn, you've shoveled as if your life depends on it all day, and hardly had a break for lunch. We pull into the station at the end of the day, and I ask the crew to join the photographers for a moment.

Which would you rather receive: a) a monetary tip; b) a round of applause and praise for the job you did; c) both?


One last question: as a railroader (part-time or full-time, volunteer or paid), do you view the position of trainman or engineman as a profession?



I'm most interested in folks who do, or have done, the job, not answers that start with "If I were an engineer . . . ". Thanks.

JAC
Author:  Dave [ Mon Jun 12, 2006 2:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
Never happened to me.

Mt Washington seems to encourage their crews to ask for tips. Haven't found this true anywhere else.

First: (thinking) they bought tickets already - are these folks nuts? I'd thank the customer, but encourage them to instead buy some stuff at the gift shop.

Second: I'd expect neither, but would appreciate a compliment from those who appreciated my work. Hopefully, a quieter form of it than applause.

Some people working in the industry treat it as a profession, some as a hobby, and some as a paycheck. Being as crusty as I am, I would limit the "professional" appelation to those who care enough and do it enough to become good at it, and maintain their skills, whether they are compensated for it or not.

dave
Author:  John Bohon [ Mon Jun 12, 2006 4:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
As a paid employee I expect nothing more than my paycheck and am satisfied with that. I would not accept the tip. As a volunteer at a nonprofit I would ask you to make a donation to the organization rather than to me. I expect no reward other than the satisfaction of doing the job and hopefully doing it well. I would not want to be singled out in either instance because it obviously takes more than just a train crew to put on such an event.

After 23 years on the railroad doing nearly every job concievable at one time or another I consider the railroad a profession. Even when I work for no pay the results can reflect on my career. I have to take that seriously.

John Bohon
Author:  Jim Vaitkunas [ Mon Jun 12, 2006 5:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
Probably four or five times in the last nine years that I have operated streetcars at both our demonstration railways I have been offered the equivalent of a tip. (I am an unpaid volunteer.) Most times it took the form of "keep the change." Maybe once or twice it was intended as an outright tip in the sense that a wait person at a restaurant would get.

In each instance my response has been to thank them for the donation to our Museum. The donor understood right away what was going on.

IMHO whether you are paid or not, a tip offered or given should be considered a donation especially when you are working for a volunteer for a non-profit group, as most of us are. Now I suppose if someone were working on a for-profit dinner train that's certainly another matter. But even volunteers who work on the extra fare "first class" car on an excursion train should be giving any tips received to the Museum group they volunteer for and who operates the excursion train.

Thanks!
Author:  junior [ Mon Jun 12, 2006 5:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
Back in the days of New Hope Steam Railway (1986 ish) I was on the train with my parents...they were working it, I was just tagging along with my friend...and a gentleman lost his glasses out the window somewhere along the line. The man needed these glasses to drive his car and his wife and kids were with him and she didn't drive. They were from NY.

Thankfully, the man immediately told my mom who knew exactly where we were and when the train arrived at Buckingham, she told my dad who was working the Engine. On the return trip, the train slowed to the area that my mom told them and a ground search begun by my dad on foot. Within minutes, the glasses were found in the brush (line was not weed sprayed as it is today) and the train proceeded back to New Hope. The gentleman and his wife offered a tip to my dad, who gave it over to the RR as a donation.

There was no thought on my parents part about keeping the tip. Like people here have said, the job is done for enjoyment, not money (unless you are paid, which most of the time is an added bonus to enjoying the hobby as I later did on the same RR.)

You are working there to give back to a community (the passengers). That's what protraying history is about no matter what you are doing.

A waiter, doorman or anything of the like where you are providing a direct, individual service to that said person, is a different story.
Author:  Txhighballer [ Mon Jun 12, 2006 6:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
A few years ago at the end of a trip,I had a group of passengers come up to me at the end of a run to compliment me on my train handling and my whistle blowing. I thanked them and they were asking me if I was a volunteer (yes) how long had I been running ( about 10 years professionally elsewhere). We talked a little about the railroad,the money situation of volunteer organizations and what not,and the leader gave me an envelope. He asked me not to look in it until the train was put away in the yard. I did as he requested,and when I opened the enzelope it had five crisp $100 bills and a note to keep up the good work! I turned it in to the powers that be at the time.
He came back with a second group a few weeks later!
Author:  softwerkslex [ Mon Jun 12, 2006 7:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
There are three categories in my opinion:

1) non-profit organization, volunteers: all "tips" should be turned into donations

2) business operation, service: anyone in a direct service position such as tour guide, waiter, car service, etc. could ethically accept tips

3) busines operation, safety: anyone in a safety supervisory position, such as engine crew, dispatcher, conductor, etc. should not accept tips, because it could set a precedent of compromising their judgement or encourage violation of safety rules. I believe that if a patron is injured as the result of a rules waiver obtained through a tip, the burden of liability is greater.

I have been in the position of engine crew and had the public ask for favors. I do not remember any significant tips. It would have been bad if the public became accustomed to interrupting our operating pattern in exchange for cash.

Historically of course, employees such as Pullman conductors were tipped heavily.
Author:  johnacraft [ Tue Jun 13, 2006 7:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
Thank you for all the responses.

JAC
Author:  Dave Crosby [ Wed Jun 14, 2006 10:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
There’s always the non-monetary “Thank You”. The box of donuts in the morning, cold water at mid-day or prints sent along to the train crew after the event have gone along way in the instances I’ve been a part of. Might work very well in cases where tipping might be taboo.

Dave Crosby (favors the donuts)
Author:  johnacraft [ Wed Jun 14, 2006 1:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
Dave Crosby wrote:
There’s always the non-monetary “Thank You”. The box of donuts in the morning, cold water at mid-day or prints sent along to the train crew after the event have gone along way in the instances I’ve been a part of. Might work very well in cases where tipping might be taboo.

Dave Crosby (favors the donuts)


Well, southerners hate Dunkin' Donuts. I wonder if Krispy Kremes stay soft if you keep 'em warm on the backhead? ;)

Prints, food, snacks and drinks are the least we can do, because the crew works a lot harder on photo specials. My goal is to always provide lunch for everyone on the crew, and keep the cab stocked with granola, Gatorade and chocolate. We get busy and forget, sometimes, or someone gets two sandwiches and a crewman gets stiffed. (It happened in New Hope in February - neither the crew nor I got lunch.) I usually ship about 50 8x10s and at least 1 16x20 to each host railroad, and to anyone bringing a car or other prop.

And you'll usually find yourself getting a round of applause at the end of the day.

What we were discussing was something I've seen on a couple of events - the practice of presenting the crew envelopes of money in a little ceremony at day's end. It always seems awkward, and on a couple of occasions in the past, I've noticed discomfort on the faces of the recipients. I was intentionally vague in hopes I wouldn't prejudice the answers.

The unanimity of responses here was interesting, but not unexpected. Anyone working on a steam train today may get paid, but he or she isn't doing it for the money. Your pride in your work is evident in your answers, and our community is lucky to have you.

JAC
Author:  Kelly Anderson [ Wed Jun 14, 2006 2:16 pm ]
Post subject:  .
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Author:  johnacraft [ Wed Jun 14, 2006 2:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
Kelly Anderson wrote:
John,

Does this mean no more rides on the foamer trip gravy train? How's a poor steam railroader to keep body and soul together?



Kelly, you blew it.

Now Linn, Rick, and Jim know I'm slipping you money under the table. Which, I should point out, is a bribe, not a tip. Different thread.

I guess you'll have to make do on that humongous salary ;)
Author:  Warren [ Wed Jun 14, 2006 3:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
While not exactly a tip as such, I do get a reward in a way when parents put thier kid in front of the engine to take a photo and when I'm driving I'll offer to sit the youngin' in the right hand seat or in the gangway and let them take thier snapshot. The smile of a kid sitting in the cab is enough to make my day.
Author:  S. Weaver [ Thu Jun 15, 2006 4:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
johnacraft wrote:
One last question: as a railroader (part-time or full-time, volunteer or paid), do you view the position of trainman or engineman as a profession?


Oh, it'a profession, and the cigars were top drawer!
Author:  johnacraft [ Thu Jun 15, 2006 6:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tipping.
S. Weaver wrote:
the cigars were top drawer!


Well, the Emperor of the North must have his cigar!

JAC
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