Take a look at the article linked below. $750,000 to restore it, $1.5 million if it is moved. Are they planning to restore it to operating condition? If not, am I missing something? Can it possibly cost $750,000 to put up a shelter and cosmetically restore it?

http://morningsentinel.mainetoday.com/news/local/3234635.shtml

Apparently you've never seen a contract and design specifications after government bureaucracies have gotten a hold of them. We have a reader of this forum who used to be a city's Director of Licensing and Inspections and did a fine job of it; I'd welcome his input if he's up to the task..........

If not, let me take a farcical stab at it: The Amish could put up a pole shed around this loco for maybe $10K. The City of Waterville, on the other hand, is probably mandated to assure that the wood is pressure-treated with certain chemicals, doesn't come from non-free-trade countries, is cut 20% by minority-owned businesses, blueprints and design work, etc.

Okay, rant against bureaucracies aside, maybe the 470 is just in THAT bad a condition now? Has the asbestos been abated? Will they have to replace most of the sheet metal? In all seriousness, transportation aside, if I showed up at Strasburg with this loco on a trailer and said "make it good for another 100 years of static display and the possibility of running it in a future generation", I'll bet that Strasburg would charge somewhere around a half-million just to make me go away, in spite of this being the perfect "apprentice" project.

And frankly, I'd rather hear them say "$750K" and come in under budget than say "$200K" and then have to come back begging three times and come in at four times the original estimate.

I worked on an advisory committee for the City of Gaithersburg to address the cosmetic overhaul of BC&G 14. An assessment by a well-known tourist railroad came in at about $200K for a fully decked-out, Museum quality static display. With the exception of some lagging around the cylinders, this engine is already abated. But it needs a boiler jacket, etc. etc. and the assesment including restoring cab jewelry (all missing). If Waterville needs to import the talent, then you must add per diem costs for housing and travel. Then add another layer of costs for bureaucratic job security "and we're off....".

Wesley

Once again a few images to illustrate the 470's condition. I'm just glad the project is still moving forward.

Not sure if this applies, but look at the date and remember that election hustle makes politicians do and say odd things. In our original proposal, $750,000 was a figure related to a climate controlled building to surround the locomotive and cosmetically restore and maintain it. We suggested a figure of one-third that to cosmetically restore it, put it under an illuminated weather shed, with ground to eaves chicken wire. I have not been included in this program since Nov., 2004, when the city engineer made a late night telephone call to me that was absolutely disconnected withthe reality of the situation, wishing to fire it up on the spot and run it. He has since publicly proposed moving the locomotive around town. I think the only thing filling with hot vapor is the Waterville City Engineer. Time will tell.

However, had you not written that letter to the mayor, and not spoken to the city council meeting at his request...NONE of this would be happening! You got the ball rolling. You made a difference.

From the news article:

"Moving the locomotive to another site, such as Head of Falls, would cost as much as $1.5 million beyond the scope of their plan, according to their estimates. Additionally, the city might find the legal hurdles involved in moving the locomotive across the tracks or up the wrong way on a one-way street to be more difficult to negotiate than raising the additional funds, Brown said."

Let's see, that's $500,000 for the rigger, and $1.45 million in traffic fines for driving the locomotive the wrong way on a one way street.

Politicians are unbelievable. It looks like they are either trying to kill the deal, or gather a massive amount of funding that can be used for pet projects elsewhere, since the loco restoration seems to have struck a chord with the public, who are now willing to let the politicians spend whatever they say they need on it.

I wish I had some better figures, but when I was poking around a couple of years ago looking for more info on the Soo 2713 display,

http://www.soo2713.org/

I ran into the minutes of a Stevens Point Dept. of Public Works public meeting that had some figures. I seem to recall $30K to prep and paint the engine, $50K for the shelter, most of which was donated, and an additional $45K for the landscaping, most of which was to come out of the parks budget. Yes, there was volunteer efforts beyond this, and I believe they are responsible for the new jacketing and lettering on the engine, outside of the painting contractors work.

Considering the project in Stevens Point started almost ten years ago, based on this I suppose $200K to do the Waterville engine is realistic.

The other $550K is my fee for pointing this out.

Based on the photos this job looks comparable to the Gainesville Midland job I did a couple years ago, which came in at under 100K thanks to the site being less than a days drive away for me and a lot of donated material and volunteer assistance. I wouldn't think 150-200 would be outrageous were I to bid this job given the unknowns relating to local support and higher travel costs involved.

I also gotta go along with Wes and Sandy regarding the additional cost imposition anytime the public sector gets heavily involved - without a practical person controlling the extent of government involvement. This worked out well in Gainesville, miserably in Charlotte with the light rail and trolley, is potentially possible in Waterville if the city engineer takes a long vacation.

Best wishes Richard, Stephen and Company.

dave

I like to remember Stephen, that we as an interested body of knowledgeable railroad historians made the problem clear in the finest light. You were there, and the stack of letters and emails from all our colleagues made a huge impact that night.

What's up with that rear cylinder head? Is it welded on?

IF the additional money (above the $250,000 which seems to be the high end of the agreed upon restoration work) is reflected in the quality of the structure that is constructed - then this *may* be a cost-effective project. A climate controlled building with a long service life will certainly do more to protect the locomotive, and offer additional interpretive/educational opporunities than a open sided building. However the gold plated specs and refusal to consider involving voulnteer associations may also be a way to stall the project by moving the price tag above what many would consider to be reasonable.

Personally, I would rather see it at the Crawford Notch helper shed - the building would provide a great shelter for it in the winter and it could be rolled outside for summer tourist trains.

Tom Cornillie

Tom -

Crawford Notch helper shed. Sounds interesting. Got a photo?

Les

A quick search of the Interchange turned this up -

As I recall this is relatively close to the Notch -

http://www.geocities.com/bhs_rr_project/page.html

Tom Cornillie