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| More on the MEC 470 https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=21855 |
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| Author: | Richard Glueck [ Tue Dec 12, 2006 7:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | More on the MEC 470 |
I brazenly stole this notice from a Maine Central forum. While I lit the fire to get the restoration started, I think this is bit over the top! For $1.8 million dollars, my first option would be to send her to Ohio Central or Strasburg and have the locomotive put into operating order! Any steam operators out there who could make better use of $1,800,000? That' s not to say the money will be forthcoming, but it's quite a sum for a static display, in my opinion. Yours? "WATERVILLE -- Councilor Charles "Fred" Stubbert Jr. puts the cost of restoring and building a shelter for the old 470 steam engine at $1.8 million. Stubbert plans to update the City Council on the project to save the city-owned locomotive from further deterioration at tonight's meeting, which is scheduled to start at 7 in City Council chambers." Read the full article at: http://morningsentinel.mainetoday.com/n ... 93937.html |
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| Author: | Dave [ Tue Dec 12, 2006 7:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: More on the MEC 470 |
I think about 150K would do a credibly good job of the restoration, based on a sort of similarly sized job I did in Gainesville, GA a couple years ago - which was posted here, come to think of it. You can spend as much as you want, of course. The building can be anything from a pole shelter to a complete museum and visitors center. I think Marietta, GA ended up spending as much or more on the little shed to cover the Glover 2=6=0 as the restoration cost itself, and they botched it too. Why put a fence so close vandals can reach the locomotive through it? dave |
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| Author: | Stephen Hussar [ Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: More on the MEC 470 |
Dave wrote: I think about 150K would do a credibly good job of the restoration, based on a sort of similarly sized job I did in Gainesville, GA a couple years ago - which was posted here, come to think of it.
You can spend as much as you want, of course. The building can be anything from a pole shelter to a complete museum and visitors center. dave Thanks, Dave. Yes, we made them aware of their options using 8X10 glossy photos from examples of success stories sent to us from across the country. $1.8 million is absurd. For that sum she could be restored and operating on the state-owned Rockland branch. |
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| Author: | robertjohndavis [ Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: More on the MEC 470 |
Wow! $1.8 million! Even though she's in rough shape, I think you are right, that would be enough to get her rebuilt. Is there any chance of getting her in the hands of a non-profit like the Owl's Head group? Rob |
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| Author: | Joshua K. Blay [ Wed Dec 13, 2006 7:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: More on the MEC 470 |
Well boys and girls, here's the plan! http://www.ci.waterville.me.us/470/imag ... design.jpg Joshua |
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| Author: | Dave [ Wed Dec 13, 2006 9:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: More on the MEC 470 |
Ok, I can see the extra cost now - building a 6 foot gage Brobdignagian saddle tanker to occupy the doorway won't be cheap. My sympathies, Stephen and Richard. Cluelessness combined with good intentions is seldom inexpensive. dave |
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| Author: | bobyar2001 [ Wed Dec 13, 2006 9:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Need text of article - can we help? would l |
Can someone post the text of this article? I was unable to access it via the MaineToday site. Would it be appropriate for some of us to comment in the media on this? As often happens in these cases, the job is turned over to persons with little expertise in the subject and a ton of money is spent doing the wrong things. It is obvious that city officials have had no interest in listening to Richard Glueck, so an editorial placed by him in a local paper would look like sour grapes, but editorials appearing from persons from afar who have really restored engines might make it in to be seen by the public. Especially if they expose poor planning and waste. It would be great if city officials had listened to those who wanted to help them, but since they have not, perhaps it is time to stir some controversy, which news media makes its living on. |
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| Author: | Stephen Hussar [ Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: More on the MEC 470 |
Joshua K. Blay wrote:
Wow -- good luck to THEM. It looks like they plan on rolling her in and out on occasion? (are those buffers?) Regardless of inaccuracies within the drawing, we can see what they're after. It's a VERY ambitious plan -- and I truly hope they succeed. |
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| Author: | ray dewley [ Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: More on the MEC 470 |
Maybe a good chunk of cash will be for the fully grown trees that will have to be planted according to the drawing. |
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| Author: | David A. Vago [ Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: More on the MEC 470 |
That sounds like the sort of figure I would come up with if I were a legislator trying to convince my fellow legislators and/or constituents not to buy into a project... Dave Vago |
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| Author: | mxdata [ Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: More on the MEC 470 |
But this is such small change compared with the Flying Yankee restoration. They must not be as good at spending money in Maine as they are in New Hampshire. MX (Not My Real Name) |
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| Author: | Stephen Hussar [ Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: More on the MEC 470 |
David A. Vago wrote: That sounds like the sort of figure I would come up with if I were a legislator trying to convince my fellow legislators and/or constituents not to buy into a project...
Dave Vago David, that was my initial reaction as well, however there is another possibility. Perhaps in Waterville, in order to get $900,000. you must start out asking for twice that amount. |
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| Author: | Richard Glueck [ Wed Dec 13, 2006 7:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Need text of article - can we help? would l |
Bob and all: Thank you for your confidence in the presentation Stephen and I assembled in 2004. I think it shook people up out of complacency, but when it was handed over as a political project, it became a focus of the board. They didn't want to listen to people who know this stuff and the plan mushroomed out of control. The city engineer hasn't a clue. In our presentation, we suggested numerous resources for doing the cosmetic restoration and three options of shelter, and specified that taxpayers money need not be tapped. I have a feeling this figure is being placed so high that citizens say something to the effect of, "Gee, it would be better to get rid of it and spend the money on schools - roads- parks- pork-whatever". Don't get me wrong on this - I would love to see her rebuilt and fired up and run once more. She's a classy locomotive, but needs new or rebuilt everything. My gosh, I do wish them luck, but I fear this is going nowhere on the fast track. God bless anyone who can get a check for $1,800,000 for steam locomotive restoration these days. If anyone chooses to write to the Morning Sentinel, don't expect my name to elicit outrage or an interview. It won't happen. I wrote several times to the reporter who covered our original presentation and she dropped me like a hot coal. Morning Sentinel doesn't want to shake up it's relationship with the City Council and the Mayor's Office. Let's watch and see what happens with this grandious scheme. Maybe you'll see the 470 completely restored to pristine perfection. It's no longer for me to say. Still, it would be a lovely light in a dark decade for big steam operations. |
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| Author: | Brian Hebert [ Wed Dec 13, 2006 9:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Uh Oh I was afraid of this |
Richard, I have to say that you are one of the most enduring and interested individuals regarding 470, but now I detect a bit of stand-offishness from your recent posts. I know they burned you because I saw what you tried to do for the engine. Your presentation to the city council in Waterville was awesome, and they were listening closely. However, the rug was pulled out from under you and handed to a group that we didn't know about. I've tried twice(in writing) to join the new 470 group and have never heard from them. I'm still interested. Perhaps the third time is the charm? I'll try again. I think you should join as well, if you haven't already. It's the only group going that is strictly for the 470s future. Forget about the 470 railroad clubs help. All they want to do is look at old pictures it seems. They have been advertising for years now that they are restoring MEC #501, but in reality they haven't done a thing for the locomotive in almost ten years. They don't even bother to spend $30 for a tarp anymore to cover the exposed boiler. Now I see this 1.8 million dollar beheamoth that the local tax payers will surely vote down, and think that there is not much knowledgeable leadership in the Railway Preservation arena in northern New England. How can the people who made up the concept for this thing expect it to be funded? There is no way it will go like this. As I recall the best choice we came up with was a shelter over the engine and tender, perhaps behind shatter proof plexiglas, with a fence around that first. Second was cosmetic restoration of 470, and later more improvements. Nothing as big as this new proposal. I'm afraid this will be scoffed at harshly, and will have an effect on 470s future. Brian Hebert |
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