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| C&O 2707 https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=21953 |
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| Author: | bobyar2001 [ Sun Dec 24, 2006 6:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | C&O 2707 |
When still displayed at Cleveland, in 1960: http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/co/co-s2707.jpg http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/co/co-s2707a.jpg http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/co/co-s2707b.jpg http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/co/co-s2707c.jpg After a couple of trades, it is safe but unrestored at IRM. I think it came close to scrapping at Cleveland, perhaps someone can elaborate. |
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| Author: | Scott [ Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707 |
Bob: As I compare these photos with others on this board, I have trouble believing that they are 44 years old. The texture, color, clarity would indicate at least 10 - 15 years later (1970-75 or later). Maybe the 1960 photographer had a very good camera. Merry Christmas to all! Scott |
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| Author: | bobyar2001 [ Mon Dec 25, 2006 10:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707 - recent photo |
At IRM: http://www.irm.org/cgi-bin/rsearch.cgi? ... +Ohio=2707 |
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| Author: | Scott [ Tue Dec 26, 2006 3:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | Ouch! |
I stand corrected. . . |
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| Author: | John Bohon [ Tue Dec 26, 2006 8:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707 |
How many of the C&O display engines got the "C&O For Progress" treatment on their tenders and/or lost the front number plate for the sign. The 2700 got a similar paint job when Huntington fixed her up a second time and put the engine on display in St. Albans. I think at least one of the PM berks had the C&O For Progress on the tender. How many others were there? What is with the number in front of the engineer instead of below the cab window on the 2707? I have never seen another C&O engine so decorated. John Bohon |
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| Author: | Les Beckman [ Tue Dec 26, 2006 11:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707 |
John Bohon wrote: How many of the C&O display engines got the "C&O For Progress" treatment on their tenders and/or lost the front number plate for the sign. The 2700 got a similar paint job when Huntington fixed her up a second time and put the engine on display in St. Albans. I think at least one of the PM berks had the C&O For Progress on the tender. How many others were there?
What is with the number in front of the engineer instead of below the cab window on the 2707? I have never seen another C&O engine so decorated. John Bohon John - For the record, the number plate (and builders plates) from our C&O Kanawha (#2789) was stolen when the locomotive was on display in Peru, Indiana's West Side Park. A 'replacement' number plate was fabricated (not very authentic) which the engine wore for a long time. Perhaps the owners of 2707 felt that the C&O for progress sign was easier to make than a replacement number plate. After the 2789 was relocated to North Judson, someone came by and offered her number plate to us. The museum decided that the plate was important to the looks of the K4 and purchased it. It currently once again resides on the smokebox door of the locomotive. For the record, the 2-8-4 is now kept inside of the museums LOCKED Shop building. Les Beckman (Hoosier Valley Railroad Museum/North Judson, Indiana) |
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| Author: | Rob Gardner [ Fri Dec 29, 2006 2:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707 |
Les, Has the interest/ability to get 2789 back in running condition changed any now that the new shortline is in place and operating the railroad into North Judson? I'm sure the tracks will need some ties and surfacing, but from what I've read, you couldn't ask for a better set of circumstances to operate a locomotive like 2789. Looking for some good news for the start of the New Year! Thanks, Rob Gardner |
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| Author: | Les Beckman [ Mon Jan 01, 2007 10:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707 |
Rob Gardner wrote: Les,
Has the interest/ability to get 2789 back in running condition changed any now that the new shortline is in place and operating the railroad into North Judson? I'm sure the tracks will need some ties and surfacing, but from what I've read, you couldn't ask for a better set of circumstances to operate a locomotive like 2789. Looking for some good news for the start of the New Year! Thanks, Rob Gardner Rob - There are a couple of problems with running on the "new" shortline that comes into North Judson. Including: 1. Although the railroad is about 33 miles long, it is actually laid out like a "T" and is not a 33 mile straight run. 2. The only turning location is where the three "legs" of the "T" come together (at LaCrosse, Indiana.) 3. One leg of this wye is actually on a tight curve. In fact, the operator of the short line will not let us haul the cabooses we use when we run passenger carrying trains to LaCrosse around this leg, and we must drop the cabooses and then take our diesel around the wye to get on the opposite end of the train for the run back to North Judson. There are a number of other factors involved, but I can tell you that, although it has long been the policy of the museum to restore #2789 to active service, the current Board of Directors has no plans in the wind to begin such a restoration. Les Beckman (Hoosier Valley Railroad Museum/North Judson, Indiana) |
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| Author: | Les Beckman [ Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707 |
Les Beckman wrote: John - For the record, the number plate (and builders plates) from our C&O Kanawha (#2789) was stolen when the locomotive was on display in Peru, Indiana's West Side Park. A 'replacement' number plate was fabricated (not very authentic) which the engine wore for a long time. Perhaps the owners of 2707 felt that the C&O for progress sign was easier to make than a replacement number plate. After the 2789 was relocated to North Judson, someone came by and offered her number plate to us. The museum decided that the plate was important to the looks of the K4 and purchased it. It currently once again resides on the smokebox door of the locomotive. For the record, the 2-8-4 is now kept inside of the museums LOCKED Shop building. Les Beckman (Hoosier Valley Railroad Museum/North Judson, Indiana) I got a letter at the museum from Kevin Kohls of Bucyrus, Ohio who advised me that I was incorrect to state that the number plate from our C&O Kanawha #2789 had been stolen. Kevin pointed out that the 2-8-4 had been in storage at Clifton Forge, Virginia as early as 1952 and that the C&O DID sell number plates off of stored power. We know that the C&O had to put a number of stored locomotives back in service in the mid-1950's due to a traffic upswing and thus had to make a replacement number plate for the 2789 at that time. Kevin states that when 2789 later became the property of HVRM, he was able to track down the owner of the original number plate and, according to Bruce Emmons our museum Treasurer, HVRM purchased a PRR number plate for $500 which was traded for the 2789 plate. Kevin subsequently received the 2789 plate, sandblasted it, painted it and returned it to HVRM and that is the plate that now proudly resides on the smokebox door of our Kanawha. Thank you Kevin for setting the record straight! Les Beckman (Hoosier Valley Railroad Musuem/North Judson, Indiana |
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| Author: | johnacraft [ Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707 |
John Bohon wrote: I think at least one of the PM berks had the C&O For Progress on the tender. How many others were there? http://www.pmhistsoc.org/pm1223.shtml Quote: Number 1223 was retired in late 1951. Despite having been assigned C&O number 2657 following the merger, she retained her number up to retirement. Following a quick shopping and a repainting into C&O livery, she was donated for display at the Michigan State Fairgrounds, where she remained on display behind the grandstands until 1981.
Question: did any of the PM Berks actually get renumbered / repainted into C&O while in active service (i.e. operate as a C&O loco)? The two survivors apparently did not. JAC |
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| Author: | Les Beckman [ Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707/other 2-8-4's |
John - The answer is YES! There are photos in the "Pere Marquette Power" book put out by the C&OHS of C&O #2699 (ex-PM #1215) WITH the "C&O for Progress" emblem in the corner of the tender and C&O #2689 (ex-PM #1205) WITHOUT the emblem. Les |
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| Author: | fmilhaupt [ Thu Jan 18, 2007 8:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707/other 2-8-4's |
To add to what Les said, the ones which were renumbered/repainted to C&O livery were all from the first batch, the N class. When they were renumbered, the C&O referred to them as N-3s. None of the N1s or N-2s[1] were renumbered or relettered for the C&O while in active service. [1] For some reason, the N1 designation wasn't typically hyphenated on the PM, but the N-2 designation was. |
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| Author: | johnacraft [ Thu Jan 18, 2007 9:16 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707/other 2-8-4's |
Les, Fritz - thanks. JAC |
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| Author: | wilkinsd [ Thu Jan 18, 2007 10:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707/other 2-8-4's |
IIRC, the reason the two newer classes of ex-PM berks were never relettered or renumbered was because the equipment trust obligations required that any equipment not fully paid for had to remain in PM lettering. I remember reading this in the C&O power book. Also, the book states that the C&O applied thicker driver tires to some of the ex PM engines, giving them 70" drivers. |
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| Author: | Les Beckman [ Thu Jan 18, 2007 2:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: C&O 2707/ex-Pere Marquette 2-8-4's |
Les Beckman wrote: John -
The answer is YES! There are photos in the "Pere Marquette Power" book put out by the C&OHS of C&O #2699 (ex-PM #1215) WITH the "C&O for Progress" emblem in the corner of the tender and C&O #2689 (ex-PM #1205) WITHOUT the emblem. Les Getting a chance to read the book text, apparently all of the C&O N-3's (ex-PM numbers 1201-1215) WERE renumbered and relettered for the C&O as numbers 2685-2699. These numbers were just below the C&O's own 2-8-4's numbered 2700-2789. None of the other ex-PM Berks were ever relettered or renumbered even though C&O numbers were assigned. Just for the record, surviving PM 2-8-4 # 1223 (currently on display in Grand Haven, Michigan) was to have been C&O number 2657 and PM #1225 at Owosso was to have become C&O #2659. Les |
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