It is my feeling that this is a disgrace:

http://trains.nute.ws/4-6-0/NYC&StL%2044.htm

What are those folks at Steamtown thinking?

Les

At Dansville, NY? I think they tore up track to it some years ago, but wonder if it would be better off back there, in care of a local group, if the building is still standing. Maybe the 565 also? The outdoor stuff at Scranton hasn't fared much better than it would have if it stayed in Vermont.. The old wooden cars are just about finished.

http://www.cr.nps.gov/history/online_bo ... /shs2n.htm

Those other photos (from the first post) were taken in Scranton as well. Always thought she might have a better home at Ft. Wayne or somewhere else. Never is a very serious word but I believe that she'll never be undercover or restored at Steamtown.

Joshua

Please note, I'd rather not start a 100-posting thread on "what's wrong at Steamtown" here, but I went there last summer, first time back since 1999, and was not really encouraged. Ranger Bill Clark gave a great shop tour, but I have to wonder if the three engines in a heavy state of dismantle will be completed in my lifetime. And the stuff parked outside was really sad, much worse than Vermont. The big engines in the parking lot, shiny black in 1999, were rusty and faded. The equipment near the walkway to the mall, like the NKP 4-6-0, was much worse.

While a steam engine with fire in its belly is great, I've come to believe it usually means whatever isn't being worked on with that in mind is getting badly neglected. Cold, static locomotives don't impress the public very much, but if we don't make an effort to get them sheltered, temporary or permanent, some of them probably won't be around much longer than we are.

Great point Bob; I've often thought it would be a great idea to spend more time and moneys in actually "preserving" locomotives for the future. Webster defines "preserve" as To save from decay; to keep in a sound state; Preservation doesn't have to mean full restoration - how about preserving something that may be able to be restored in the future. An ounce of preservation/decay-prevention today will make things a lot easier in the future if the opportunity becomes available and will pay for itself if/when restoration is done. It may not even be in our lifetimes.

...something like "we don't have enough budget"?

Pathetic.

I've also come to believe that equipment has more meaning when it is displayed in a historically appropriate setting. As an example, Steamtown has the corpse of Lowville & Beaver River "Cuban" 2-8-0 1923, whose only use was on that NY shortline. A historical group now has the run of that shortline and the very enginehouse and turntable that once housed and turned the 1923 are still in use. I've yet to get over there, but I understand the enginehouse houses the L&BR 44-tonner, plus the group's now-inoperable
Shay and the former O. Winston Link Rutland combine. If room could be found, the 1923 might be cosmetically restored and kept in its old home, to be brought for various events, but safely sheltered the rest of the time.

http://www.newyorkrailroads.com/L&BR/

There's some good news to report- engine 2713 is due out this Spring for the road not just yard, she's getting new tires as we speak. 3254 is operable and the 26 is making steady progress.

Also keep in mind that Steamtown has nothing to do with 1361 except for providing a space to work and also that the 3713 is being funded (entirely except for grant and donations?) by the local NRHS chapter.

I love Steamtown and really enjoy visiting. However, observations in recent visits have been a bit troubling- for example how much restoration work has been done since 1998 or 1999? Almost none that I can tell and the most significant equipment (DL&W milk car and DL&W 565) remains untouched. Bob mentioned the condition to locomotive along the entrance road, I would add the CNJ crane, and various pieces in the yard. I realize that the trackage is tight but something is needed. Some sort of covered storage would be wonderful (tarps, encapsulation, a structure) but that probably isn’t possible due to the historic nature of the site. "Not enough money" only works for so long. The quality of the gift shop has deteriorated as well. Permanent exhibits are unchanged. Something new and different is needed to encourage people to come to the site. Either in display, programming, or what have you.

How about the idea of repainting 2713 in its foundation era scheme for a themed weekend? Borrowing equipment from the RRMPA or other institutions for display?
How about Thomas? (Just think of him sitting next to the 4012).

(Insert your idea here and I realize that Steamtown is limited in finance and promotion, and that the ideas mentioned above may not be possible- just brainstorming).

I believe in the purpose and promise of Steamtown, and look forward to the coming years.

Joshua

The Steamtown Gift Shop at one time was one of the better such places around. They had just the right mix of "serious" railfan collectibles, books, models, etc. along with a good selection of kids stuff and quality toys.

But this operation was run by the local Steamtown Museum Volunteer Bookshop Association (forgive me if I have the name wrong, it's been a while). The Association turned over all its profits for various projects at Steamtown. From what I understand it was a nice chunk of change.

About two years ago the NPS told them to get lost and they had to vacate the store. They have now been replaced by the regional concession that does all of the East Coast. I think they are called Eastern News Service. And they do a mediocre job at Steamtown, and frankly at every historic site where they operate.

My understanding is those nice quarterly checks have stopped.

Unfortunately money from Washington is hard to get, but if you care to write a check for hazmat mitigation and restoration, I'm sure the NPS will be happy to cash it, although I think current law disallows private donations that contain restrictions on its use.

You also might see fit to give Representative Kanjorski a call, but then again, you will notice despite relative safety of his seat (usually gets about 70% when there's an opponent), and 20 some year tenure, Representative Kanjorski doesn't seem to be among the rare air of Speaker/Majority Whip, etc. The cold political calculus that dominates Washington is clear: No point in throwing newly acquired political capital (or appropriations) to a facility located into an area is that is losing population and is already reliably in your pocket.

Additionally, Steamtown was Representative McDade's baby and in a different district until the most recent redistricting. I'm not sure that it is a concern anymore but as I recall Rep. Kanjorski was friends with the late Rep. Bruce Vento, who became a vehement oppononent of Steamtown because Mr. McDade used parliamentary manuvering to avoid Mr. Vento's committee.

Politics is about getting (more) votes and MONEY. You see anybody, anywhere, in any party making a campaign promise to fund any kind of historic preservation?

Steamtown Volunteer has hit the nail squarely on the head. It's all about the money and the trade-offs that are an integral part of how the system functions(?) in Washington.
There was zero doubt that when Mr. McDade retired S'towns fortunes would decline. If it weren't for the dynamics of the Federal gyroscope it probably would have been defunded by now???
Anyhow,it is what it is and the best we can do is to encourage whomever is in charge at the moment to try to get as many dollars as possible into maintenance/restoration, and hope that by some miracle Uncle Sam will someday outsource its operation to a creative,accomplished private sector operator???
Hope springs eternal!!!
Ross Rowland