A friend of mine loaned me his DVD's of the last years of NKP Berkshires in service, and it triggered a thought. In many of the shots, the steam locos are worn, looking like they haven't seen a wash in months. In other cases, particularly those touching toward October of 1958, certain locomotives are seen leaving the shops in beautiful condition. IIRC, NKP was one of the railroads that serviced a number of their biggest steam locomotives, then shoved them aside onto storage tracks, never to run again. The UP Big Boy, 4018, at the Age of Steam Museum is a similar case, with new tubes and never fired. Any of the other preserved steam locos shut down in excellent condition, then put aside?

Is it also true that NKP 759 was the last Berk shopped prior to retirement? If so, how did that figure into her restoration to service?

Richard,

That's an interesting observation. The guys in Washington Court House, Ohio who were (are) working on restoring C&O Kanawha 2776 had told me years ago that they have found numerous date stamps on things like side rod bushings that, when matched up with in/out of service dates, indicate that this engine ran less than a year after getting a fairly major overhaul.

My guess is that it's probably just coincidence. However, most groups usually look at how thoroughly worn out an engine is before they decide to begin a restoration.

Rob Gardner

You're on the money, Richard. The last overhaul of a Nickel Plate Berkshire was at Conneaut in May 1958 - and the locomotive was NKP 759. Conneaut is also where 759 was restored to service for the High Iron Company in 1968. As I understand it these repairs were finite, and the locomotive would enter service a few more times, only to suffer unfortunate mechanical setbacks (flues bursting, freeze damage, etc) which had the locomotive sidelined since before Steamtown's move to Scranton.

Seth Corwin, a fireman from the High Iron days, and a current volunteer at Steamtown says it needs is a little TLC...and a Form 4 of course.

The Nickel Plate had a number of Berkshires stored serviceable until a recession in 1957 kept them them cold - permanently. This practice however would help NKP 765, which was able to utilize flues from NKP 757 in the 80's.

By the way, is Steam Was Great on the NKP in the collection your friend loaned you?

June, 1958 sees a filthy Berkshire on train #55 west of Valparaiso, Indiana:

Kelly, these DVD's were filmed by a fellow named Don Krofta, who showed remarkable foresight in shooting the absolute end of NKP, NYC, PRR, and other steam power on major roads. He probably took heat for expending money on tape and equipment to shoot mere "trains" during that era. Today the documentation is priceless. These are a set of three separate programs, each narrated. I want to point out that these are on loan from a friend's library, and not illegal copies.

Anyone who wants to hear and see the last of big steam in the midwest, owes it to himself to consider these videos/DVD's. I particularly look for the 765, 759, 757, 763, and 779, in the series. I believe I've seen all five Berks under steam in the video series.

Thanks, Richard. For anyone interested, Jim Herron publishes a lot of Krofta's work.

http://www.herronrail.com/video_store.html

I always wonder if gents like Krofta or Jim Shaugnessy ever thought their work would be so coveted by historians some forty-eight after it was captured...

KL

Thanks Richard and KL for the plug. Yes, Don Krofta is one of the best of the 16mm railfan cameramen. As for NKP, the good news is that he has footage ready for a fourth NKP volume. I'll tackle it when I finish the second B&O volume, which I'm doing now. I didn't enter the thread to spam anyone but since you guys mentioned it, I guess it's OK.

The thing that's so good about Krofta's film is that he has attention to detail and shoots close-ups of valve gear, men at work, creative angles, and often gets the locomotive numbers clearly. He also has a lot of original sound recordings, made on the scene by his late friend, Jim Hawk, which I use to bring the film to life.

A lot of his work seems to go hand in hand with the coverage by David P. Morgan and Phil Hastings during their 1955-56 tour of the end of steam on NKP, NYC, B&O, IC, CN, CP and others in the book, "The Mohawk that Refused to Abdicate" which is going to be re-run by Kalmbach in a series of paperback books/magazines titled "In Search of Steam" beginning this year.
-Jim Herron

Krofta made an unbelieveable contribution by documenting the last of steam. Your DVD's are no small contributions in their own right. Great to hear that a fourth volume of NKP steam is possible!
I don't suppose Don shot the final years of my pet road, the LIRR?

Back to the main thread, are there any other locomotive fleets that were overhauled and then put out to pasture, unfired, then delivered as preserved equipment at athe close of steam?

Richard, I'm glad you like our videos. Thanks!

As for overhauled engines that ended up as preserved, one that comes to mind is the IC 4-8-2 at McComb, MS. It reportedly was outshopped, ran a break in trip and went into retirement. It would be great to see it run again.

I recall seeing a freshly shopped IC 2-10-2 at Louisville in October or November, 1957 with dieselization on the Louisville-Central City part of the Kentucky division only 2-3 months away. Of course, steam continued in the Paducah area for another year or two. Some say it lasted into 1961 or '62. When I was at Paducah on May 14, 1960, there were around 300 engines gathered for scrapping, which was under way at the time.

-Jim Herron

Actually I do not think NKP ever completed the 759. I remember reading in one of the old High Iron books that grates were borrowed from 757 because NKP had never reinstalled them in 759. There may have been a few other minor parts as well. The 757 also donated her left cylinder head, piston, and piston rod to 759 after the crosshead key came out on an excursion on the N&W. The piston struck the cylinder head and damaged the parts. The repairs were made in the WM shop in Hagerstown. I do not remember hearing about a burst flue on 759 but a water glass did burst on one of the Horseshoe Curve trips. Did 765 really get flues from 757? If so that old girl is becoming quite an empty shell.

As for other zero mileage engines I think there are, or perhaps were, several. I seem to remember another NKP berk does not have any mileage after her last NKP overhaul, perhaps 755. All of the CPR G-5 pacifics that came to the US after steam were either low mileage or perhaps zero mileage engines before George Hart and Steamtown put them to work. I also remember reading the CPR surbaban tank Hudson that operated very breifly on one of the early Steamtown operations had never been run since overhaul. I think it was taken out of service because the ICC inspector determined it had never been certified to operate in the US as had the pacifics. I have often been told the two MEC consolidations originally at Steamtown were zero mileage engines but I have now been told they are low mileage instead.

The Santa Fe overhauled a number of their 4-8-4 and 2-10-4 locomotives to be held in reserve for traffic upswings. Some never ran again and I would hope a few may have been preserved. I think a few other roads did the same thing. I remember reading that when Strasburg returned 7002 to service they found it had never been fired since the last set of flues had been installed. I am sure there are others.

Having seen some of Don Krofta's work on RFD TV I have to say he did us a great favor preserving an era on film. His work is excelent. Unfortunately I am one who seldom watches a video more than once so I make it a point not to buy them. The truth is I have several I have never watched. Krofta is one of the few whose work makes me think of buying tapes. Some of the stuff he includes in the background scenes is more interesting than the trains.

John Bohon

The flue bursting incident was written to have taken place at Steamtown, post High Iron days. But the work on 759 halted thereafter. I didn't know about the water glass, though!

757 and 779 have definitely made many beneficial contributions to their "sisters."


I wish I knew the year, as it could very likely be after the High Iron days...
Edit: This is 759, in Bellows Falls.

Say, where are these old High Iron books abound? I'd like to get my mits on 'em.

KL

Santa Fe serviced their road engines right up to the last days. Many of the engines put out to pasture had scant 10K miles on them after class repairs.

That is an interesting picture. Do you know how many flues were taken out of the 757? The 757 looks to be a high mileage engine so I have to wonder how good the flues were in her. I knew 779 had given some parts to 765 but I do not remember what they were.

I made a quick search for my High Iron books with no luck. They are in the rubble around here somewhere but I have no idea where. I think the titles were High Iron 1971 and 1972. The 1971 book covered 759 from removal from Steamtown through 1970. The 1972 book covered 759 and other mainline steam in 1971. Some of the other operations I remember were George Harts 972 running out of Jim Thorpe, Southern 722 and 750 doubleheading, and 2102 on the C&O Greenbrier branch. There may have been others. Also in the 1972 book is an anouncement by Ross of the Freedom Train as the next HICO project.

I do not know where you will find them but I have seen a few for sale at swap meets occasionally and there is always Ebay. If Ross is following this thread he may even have a few stashed away somewhere. Good luck. They are neat little picture books.

John Bohon

There were three editions of the High Iron books that I did as author for Steve Bogen's Quadrant Press. The first one was issued in 1971; it was planned in early 71 as an annual covering HICO trips, before HICO was temporarily shut down in August 1971. This edition was sort of a semi -official HICO publication.

The second edition was issued in 1972, and Steve and I decided to expand coverage to include 1971 runs of various eastern fantrip steam, such as 759, 2102, 6218, etc. The third and last edition covered 1972 and 73 trips of 2102, 759, 4501 and 6060.

The layout was typical Early Quadrant Press work, very simple indeed-- done by the paste-up guy at Prior King Press in Middletown, NY where Steve had his books printed. It was fun doing the books; I think I have a couple of copies of each edition around somewhere in a storage box. I doubt Ross has a "stash" of them anywhere. As John mentioned, they do show up on E-bay from time to time.

Howard P.
former author, former foamer, current track-builder

Why do I continue to have the feeling that 779 is in extremely good condition, and could be brought back without too much work? This is merely based on a hunch, but I don't know why I have it! 765 is, of course, in beautiful shape. One can only speculate on 763's operational status, at least until she's moved. 759 should be the next major overhaul in the Steamtown shops, at least after the B&M Pacific and 1361 leave. It would be a sight only equaled in the Frofta movies, to see double-headed Berks once again.

I might make a deferential hat-tip here to Ross Rowland, who single handedly did more to revive big steam locomotives in the late 60's and 70's, strating with the 759.

After inspection last summer NKP 384 (alco 0-6-0) appears to be a overhaul and put on display engine. During the inspection the person conducting it made a call stateing he's found the "urban ledgend" park engine. The nasty A word stuff had been removed in the early 80's and some ultra sound shows a good thick boiler. pistons appear great etc etc.
Now all I have to do is find people that want to help restore it and run it on our line.