Here's the photo in question. Thanks for posting the update, Dave. And best of luck in the new job!
Stephen
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| Georgetown Loop update https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=22984 |
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| Author: | bobyar2001 [ Wed May 16, 2007 10:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Georgetown Loop update |
Not official, but it appears both steam locomotives are dismantled at this time, and IRCA 2-8-0 111 is being worked on at Strasburg (Colorado) by Uhrich Locomotive Works for use at the Loop. The unusual Porter diesel, originally from the Plaster City line in California is being repaired at the Sumpter Valley for use at the Loop also. http://www.ngdiscussion.net/cgi-bin/NGD ... read=93286 |
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| Author: | Dennis Storzek [ Wed May 16, 2007 6:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
This, right here, makes the best argument for replicating a steam engine. A historical site that wants to run an operation intensive "display railroad" to give the feeling of the times, that finds itself, due to the limitations of its physical plant, with only hundred year old historic pieces that have been out of service for more than half a century and ex-industrials of questionable maintenance history as their potential operating roster. The following arguments could be made: Leave the historic engines on static display; don't butcher them further by beating them to death trying to run them seven days a week. Do the sugar cane engine and Plaster City diesel really do the job of giving the visitors the "period experience"? Did they really pull the train up the hill with Grandpa's old farm tractor? Could we design a modern welded boiler to the historic outline, put it on a water jet cut frame, equip the inboard bearings with off the shelf roller bearings and possibly end up with more reliable motive power that takes less maintenance and not consume every last scrap of our industrial heritage in the process of trying to display it? The National Park Service took this route for the Golden Spike display, and I would assume that one reason they did so was there were absolutely no existing engines from the period, and any junkers they would have tried to rebuild would have looked silly, because they were forty years too new and much heavier than the historically correct engines. I applaud their decision. Millions of people have seen the driving of the golden spike recreated, and not a single bit of the historic fabric has been consumed. When the engines finally wear out, they can just build new ones again. I predict, if there is ever another steam replica built in the US, it will be narrow gauge. There are three big operations that A) give their engines hard use, and B) make money (well, at least two of them do). At some point they will simply have consumed all the available engines, and will be forced to build new. |
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| Author: | Kelly Anderson [ Thu May 17, 2007 6:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | . |
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| Author: | Dave [ Thu May 17, 2007 7:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
Making it official. Georgetown Loop will open on Memorial Day weekend as scheduled, but with a truncated train on a short run. We have scheduled a largish program of tie replacement on the top half of the railroad, and still have no running water at the Silver Plume terminal, as a result of the towns water system replacement not having been finished before blizzard season last year. SVRR has run into a little difficulty with suppliers of the unusual parts necessary to put the final work into USG 1203, and project its delivery about beginning July. Federal funding to rebuild the rebuild of 9 is slated for June, and will most likely be done by outside contractors - lowest bidders. Get your insurance certificates now, guys. 12 is progressing, but had a later start than everybody wished. We hope to have 12 available in the first half of June. Which leaves us with 21 as the running engine now, with a maximum capacity of 4 cars, happier with 3. Given the facilities issues in Plume, we have opted to run from the Devil's Gate boarding area in Georgetown up to Lebanon Mine and back down to Georgetown, 8 times per day, short, frequent turns with a much reduced ticket price initially. Once we have gotten through the facilities problems and have a larger locomotive available, we will return to the 5 full round trips per day schedule. 12 is a very sweet little engine that will work its heart out, but the other side of that equasion is the annual maintenence that must be performed to assure it will be ready to run the following year. Few railroads beat their power mercilessly to the extent that running capacity trains on the Loop does. Colorado Historical Society has recognized this, and announced publicly last night that they will support a program of off season, through winter maintenence activities in the shop starting this year. I do not anticipate using 9 in daily revenue service even when rebuilt - it is too fragile and lightweight to have the robustness of 12. It has power, but not stamina. Beating it to death annually is not an appropriate life for an artifact in any case. 111 is the only locomotive in the entire considered list with the robust construction and power to haul our capacity trains with a margin left over - and we eagerly anticipate its eventual arrival. I'd kill for a good, robust modern replica of, say, a nice 2-8-0. Preferably 2. Railstar Corporation is seriously considering the possibility of replicating small steam, and not only for the Loop, and we have a small start of a design team loosely gathered for informal bits of brainstorming as the concept evolves slowly, and we consider the extent of the market and potential partners in development. Don't hold your breath, but don't discount the idea entirely at this time either. BTW, we at the enginehouse do actually peruse the Narrow Gage get-a-life forum now and again for amusement, but never post. No point spoiling their fun with factual information. I'd rather post it here where it will be appreciated and understood. Please do stop in the enginehouse if you get up this way this year, anybody seriously interested in this business. Dave Lathrop CMO Railstar Corporation |
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| Author: | Ted Krumreich [ Thu May 17, 2007 10:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
Dave, thanks for posting this. I do believe that some information from someone in an official capacity at Railstar has been needed for some time. Will try to stop up and see you. |
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| Author: | Alan S. Levy [ Thu May 17, 2007 10:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
Dave, Thanks for giving us the real scoop. It's always nice to hear right from the horses mouth! Good luck this season! |
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| Author: | Les Beckman [ Thu May 17, 2007 12:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
Dave wrote: Making it official.
Georgetown Loop will open on Memorial Day weekend as scheduled, but with a truncated train on a short run. I'd kill for a good, robust modern replica of, say, a nice 2-8-0. Preferably 2. Railstar Corporation is seriously considering the possibility of replicating small steam, and not only for the Loop, and we have a small start of a design team loosely gathered for informal bits of brainstorming as the concept evolves slowly, and we consider the extent of the market and potential partners in development. Don't hold your breath, but don't discount the idea entirely at this time either. Dave Lathrop CMO Railstar Corporation Dave - Thanks for your comments. I seem to recall that the C&TS has one or two of their ex-D&RGW 2-8-2's out of service. Has Railstar considered trying to acquire one of those engines? Or are they too heavy for the High Bridge? Les |
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| Author: | Ted Krumreich [ Thu May 17, 2007 12:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
Les, the D&RGW K-36's are far too large for the Loop. It is not so much an issue of weights as it is clearances. Primarily, the clearances through the rock cut just above the mine stop. Ted Krumreich Formerly with Georgetown Loop RR Inc. |
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| Author: | Dave [ Thu May 17, 2007 2:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
First, thanks for your kind words of support - this will be a challenging season. Ted completely understands the limiting factors about what we can run here. The railroad includes among its challenges a 30 degree curve on a high fill followed (or led) by a 4.13% grade tangent, which ends at a kink of a corner onto a trestle into a very narrow rock lined cut. Either direction is an operating challenge - either holding the speed down or having virtually no chance to take a run at the grade. Shays worked very nicely here, and I'd love to see a little Garrat or Mallet try it sometime. Rigiid wheelbases can't be too long here. dave |
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| Author: | Les Beckman [ Thu May 17, 2007 5:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
Ted and Dave - Thanks for the clarification. Les |
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| Author: | softwerkslex [ Thu May 17, 2007 6:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
Thanks for the news. It is interesting to me that an engine from Hawaii is more powerful than a native colorado engine. One of the old pictures on the http://www.georgetownlooprr.com/about_us/history.shtml website shows a train with 3 full size coaches plus open observation. How does a train like that compare to the modern train? Is that a 6 wheel or 8 wheel engine in that photo? |
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| Author: | Dave [ Fri May 18, 2007 8:32 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
Not more powerful - more robustly constructed. More durable might be a better explaination. I don't know about the photo - can't open it. Historically, the C&S lokies made occasional trips to Silver Plume according to the demands of business. they also had a nicely equipped roundhouse to go back to for constant care and there were many of them available so none got particularly beat without getting repaired in a timely way. It's a different world. dave |
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| Author: | Stephen Hussar [ Fri May 18, 2007 3:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
Here's the photo in question. Thanks for posting the update, Dave. And best of luck in the new job! Stephen
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| Author: | PhilJ [ Fri May 18, 2007 7:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
I would think that train would be maximum tonnage for that engine going up the Loop. Interesting to hear from Dave that #9 doesn't seem as robustly built as the #12. For all her trips over the old South Park line you'd think she'd be a pretty tough old girl. I know in all the years I looked at her in decrepit condition on the Morningstar spur I was always impressed at how big she actually was for a 3ft gauge mogel. I would have to agree with his comment that #9 should be used on special occasions and not used up in daily service. Along those lines it would also be cool to make her a coal burner again and just take special precautions whenever she ran. #111 should be a good engine for the Loop and will be sight to see pulling 8 or 9 cars up the grade. Phil |
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| Author: | elueck [ Fri May 25, 2007 12:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Georgetown Loop update |
The Narrow Gage discussion forum is full of reports and discussion regarding the fact that the Georgetown Loop will not open now before June 15 which is when they plan to have #12 back in service. |
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