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William Mason 2008?
https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=24575		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  superheater [ Sun Jan 06, 2008 4:29 pm ]
Post subject:  William Mason 2008?
I checked the B& O website but no mention.

Any chance this engine will run in '08?

A couple of you tube posts made it interesting
Author:  Chris Salmonson [ Sun Jan 06, 2008 8:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: William Mason 2008?
How many Masons will run in 2008?
Author:  C. Edwards [ Sun Jan 06, 2008 10:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: William Mason 2008?
I believe there there will only be one steam days this year due to the return to the B&O of everyone's favorite little blue friend in the spring. So the October steam days will probably be it. The Mason is a crowd pleaser so I would be surprised if we didn't have it out for that event. Of course barring any unforseen mechanical issues.

On another exciting note look for the return of the Memnon to the roundhouse in the near future...... but you didn't hear that from me.
Author:  scottychaos [ Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: William Mason 2008?
Chris Salmonson wrote:
How many Masons will run in 2008?


Perhaps 100% of Masons that survive! :)

There are are only two surviving Mason locomotives..
and incredibly, both are in operating condition!

there is the "William Mason" of course. a 4-4-0 from 1856.

and the 2nd is the "Torch Lake", the only surviving Mason Bogie locomotive.
0-6-4T, built 1873.
She is at the Henry Ford museum in Dearborn, MI.

http://www.steamlocomotive.info/vlocomo ... isplay=634

A "Mason bogie" was a very unique type of locomotive..
they look like forneys, with the "tank/tender" attached to the frame..
but they differed from regular forneys in that the drivers pivoted under the boiler!

approx 50 were built, the majority were 3-foot gauge, but several were standard gauge. One was even 6-foot gauge! (for the Erie)

http://www.ironhorse129.com/Prototype/M ... _Bogie.htm

"Torch Lake" is the only survivor of the type.

Scot
Author:  Matthew Goodman [ Mon Jan 07, 2008 2:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: William Mason 2008?
Chris Salmonson "Steam Locomotive Engineer" wrote:
How many Masons will run in 2008?

I think I saw Mr. Salmoson servicing the grease cellars under the Torch Lake today. It should be ready to roll by mid-April.


Matthew Goodman
Railroad Specialist
the Henry Ford
Author:  Chris Salmonson [ Mon Jan 07, 2008 5:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Torch Lake
Yeah, my hands are still dirty from those Grand Canyon grease blocks. Only two more cellars to do. I'm glad we don't have a Decapod!
Author:  jasonsobczynski [ Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: William Mason 2008?
It is amazing that a locomotive as mechanically complete as the WM is still operational. The torch lake would be considered a "Historic Replica" as it has a new cab, boiler, piping, axles, 1 wheel center, shoes & wedges, rod bearings and engine bolster. Don't get me wrong, that is one shrp looking locomotive.
Author:  Chris Salmonson [ Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Torch Lake
No, the Torch Lake is not a replica. When locomotives are used in daily service, bearings wear down, boilers slowly lose metal, crank pins lose integrity, tires become condemnable and Mother Nature wants to reclaim the other elements forged into the locomotive. It certainly doesn't help when a locomotive is involved in a roundhouse fire. I wouldn't want to fire a boiler that is 135 years old (nor expect the State inspector to pass it), run without a cab, have to deal with lame bearings or worst yet, not even operate it.
Author:  C. Edwards [ Mon Jan 07, 2008 11:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: William Mason 2008?
The William Mason is a machine, but we at the museum are not entirely sure how much of it is original. The boiler was replaced for the fair in '27 and while it is possible we are not sure that the cab is original either. The frame most likely is, and possibly the driver centers.
Author:  scottychaos [ Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: William Mason 2008?
Its like the classic "Grandfather's axe" expression:

"It's had three new heads and four new handles but it's still the same old axe."


Just because some things have been replaced doesnt mean its not "original"..even if 95% has been replaced!

For a locomotive, I would argue that even if 100% is no longer original, its still the same engine! ;)
If the replacements happened gradually over the normal life of the engine..replacing one piece at a time, over many decades, until EVERYthing has been relaced..its still the same engine, and cant be considered a replica..

a replica is a totally different concept..

Scot
Author:  prr643 [ Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: William Mason 2008?
I'm not a huge fan of using the world "Replica" myself, at least in regards to locomotives. I personally only consider a locomotive a a replica if it was not built original design, or is of very antiquated design. Some of the replicas of early steam locomotives that various museaums around the country have I would consider replicas. In the case of many of these replicas there are not original plans to work from, so they had to do the best they could form existing information.

Now the A1 Peppercorn pacific (www.a1steam.com) being built in the UK is not in my mind a replica. It is modern built new member of the class. It has been built as closly as possible to the original plans, with a some allowances for modern operation and safety.

Just a few thoughts.
Author:  jasonsobczynski [ Tue Jan 08, 2008 8:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Torch Lake
The term used is "historic replica", that is a curatorial term used when referring to an item that is constructed using some original parts but primarily of new or otherwise replacement parts...I don't make the rules. Just as the edison is a 19__ product of the Ford Motor Company using some original parts.
The "original" boiler of the Torch Lake(the one it had upon arrival to the museum) is of late twenties construction per the ID number on the backhead. Also, that boiler was built for either 175 or 180 pounds(I forget which). I actually bought copies of the paperwork originally filed on that boiler while I worked at the village. It had been downrated to 120 or 125 and it can only be presumed that that is why the current boiler is of such low pressure. Rather than engineer a boiler based upon original construction it was engineered based upon most recent operating pressure.
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