FCG/ ENFE Robore Workshop, Bolivia

mjanssen · **Posted:** Tue Mar 04, 2008 2:38 pm

Does anyone have more information or pictures of the locomotives at the Robore workshops? Specifically, 2-8-4's # 555 & 556? I am wondering if these are the French GELSA locomotives built for Brazil that were exported to Bolivia and ran until 1974/6. Thank you, Matt Janssen

whodom · **Posted:** Tue Mar 04, 2008 4:21 pm

It'd be awfully nifty to bring one of those to the U.S. and re-gauge it to 3 feet. Imagine a Berk on the narrow gauge in Colorado!

What became of the 4-8-4's that were built at the same time?

survivingworldsteam · **Posted:** Tue Mar 04, 2008 6:05 pm

mjanssen wrote:

Does anyone have more information or pictures of the locomotives at the Robore workshops? Specifically, 2-8-4's # 555 & 556? I am wondering if these are the French GELSA locomotives built for Brazil that were exported to Bolivia and ran until 1974/6. Thank you, Matt Janssen

There are twenty locomotives derelict at Robere. And yes indeed, 555 and 556 are Gelsa built examples from 1950. I do not have any contemporary photographs of them, only a builder's photo sent to me by a contributor in France.

Quote:

What became of the 4-8-4's that were built at the same time?

Are you referring to the ALCO built examples, Hugh? If so, three of them (851, 852, 853) are in the graveyard at Uyuni; mentioned recently in a previous post. Another contributor sent a picture of 853; it looks rough, but reasonably complete.

whodom · **Posted:** Tue Mar 04, 2008 7:54 pm

survivingworldsteam wrote:

Quote:

What became of the 4-8-4's that were built at the same time?

Are you referring to the ALCO built examples, Hugh? If so, three of them (851, 852, 853) are in the graveyard at Uyuni; mentioned recently in a previous post. Another contributor sent a picture of 853; it looks rough, but reasonably complete.

James,

No, GELSA built a series of 4-8-4's at the same time the 2-8-4's were built. They shared many common parts but the 4-8-4's were considerably more powerful. They may not have survived to leave Brazil.

survivingworldsteam · **Posted:** Tue Mar 04, 2008 9:09 pm

whodom wrote:

survivingworldsteam wrote:

Quote:

What became of the 4-8-4's that were built at the same time?

Are you referring to the ALCO built examples, Hugh? If so, three of them (851, 852, 853) are in the graveyard at Uyuni; mentioned recently in a previous post. Another contributor sent a picture of 853; it looks rough, but reasonably complete.

James,

No, GELSA built a series of 4-8-4's at the same time the 2-8-4's were built. They shared many common parts but the 4-8-4's were considerably more powerful. They may not have survived to leave Brazil.

Then I don't know for sure. I don't have them listed; but I know based on a recent book from Brazil that I am missing 67 locomotives from that country. So, they may yet still exist.

mjanssen · **Posted:** Wed Mar 05, 2008 1:10 am

James, I have the Brazil book - PM me - I would be happy to help you out.

whodom · **Posted:** Wed Mar 05, 2008 7:29 am

Here are links to some info on the locomotives at Thierry Stora's webpage:

Photos: http://thierry.stora.free.fr/english/pgal_bra.htm

Data: http://thierry.stora.free.fr/english/te ... htm#Brazil

They were the only "clean sheet" designed steam locomotives Chapelon was able to see built. They were simple expansion machines but otherwise incorporated his design philosophy in the way of streamlined steam circuits, Kylchap exhausts, etc.

survivingworldsteam · **Posted:** Thu May 15, 2008 9:56 pm

survivingworldsteam wrote:

whodom wrote:

survivingworldsteam wrote:

Quote:

What became of the 4-8-4's that were built at the same time?

Are you referring to the ALCO built examples, Hugh? If so, three of them (851, 852, 853) are in the graveyard at Uyuni; mentioned recently in a previous post. Another contributor sent a picture of 853; it looks rough, but reasonably complete.

James,

No, GELSA built a series of 4-8-4's at the same time the 2-8-4's were built. They shared many common parts but the 4-8-4's were considerably more powerful. They may not have survived to leave Brazil.

Then I don't know for sure. I don't have them listed; but I know based on a recent book from Brazil that I am missing 67 locomotives from that country. So, they may yet still exist.

After reviewing the Brazil book that Matt so graciously sent to me (thanks, Matt); it appears that none of the GELSA locomotives remain in Brazil. Only the two previously mentioned, 555 and 556 at Robore workshops; remain.

On a side note, after reviewing the Brazil book, the latest information coming in from Angola, and some material sent to me on survivors from the former Soviet Union, my world steam locomotive database is thought to be 99% complete. Known to be missing are 232 from the former Soviet Union (they were on the SZD inventory at the time Soviet Locomotive Types was published by Heywood & Button, Stenvall in 1995); 10 in Guatemala; 8 in Puerto Rico; 7 in Columbia; 5 in Lebanon; 1 in Costa Rica; an unknown number in Angola, Guinea, North Korea (as mentioned recently), and Saudi Arabia; and unknown industrial locomotives in China and elsewhere. The current release contains 21,418 locomotives in 148 countries.