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3985 Report? https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=25694	Page 1 of 3

Author:	BarryD [ Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:21 am ]
Post subject:	3985 Report?
To anyone at Wasatch Railroad contractors John said that a report would be made on the results of testing the Lemor Exhaust on 3985. Is the "offical" testing complete yet and if so, is the report out yet? Is the work applicable to 844? Thanks!

Author:	Trevor Heath [ Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:11 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
Barry, I've been told that the UP has put the clamps on everyone involved in the 3985 project talking about the results. As those involved would like to retain their employment either directly or as a sub contractor, we can expect to hear nothing via this medium at all. TH

Author:	John E. Rimmasch [ Tue Aug 05, 2008 6:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
Hey guys, John E. Rimmasch here from Wasatch RR Contractors. Thanks for the question. I have been out of the country working on steam in Switzerland. See our web page for more information. http://www.wasatch-rr-contractors.com Let me clear the air a bit. Union Pacific can not ban me from speaking of the work that we (WRC) do (does). That would be a violation of my personal Constitutional Rights. They really can not even gag their own employees. Rest assured, the lack of public information regarding the 3985 is not a result of any gag order neither for the UP employees or the sub-contractors. However, I, like the rest of you, love the UP Steam Program. It is a great honor to get to work with them. As we well see on this page and other pages, the speculation on performance runs rampant. This is why we have stopped talking about it. The performance enhancing measures applied are difficult to understand and explain and to the run of the mill railfan…..they may seem mindless at best. At the request of Mr. Lee and the UP, I have not allowed any of my company members to post on the subject. We need not “stir the pot” if you will. The UP employees do not frequent these pages, so you will most likely never hear from them on the web. Out of respect to the request of UP, I will not comment on the 3985 or what has been done or is being done. This is the job of the UP. As always, when ready I am sure that a comment will be made. Until then…….. I will tell you this……I am very proud of the work that has been done and the cooperation of UP. I am excited that these types of innovations are being considered. Our company, WRC is installing similar advancements in Europe even as we speak. The truth of the matter is; the fuel issues facing the world will cause all of us to re-evaluate the fuels we use and the quantities in which we waste the same. UP has been very open minded to these ideas. UP has always been a leader in advancement. I think the entire industry could take a lesson from the UP. May I ask this….is your favorite RR searching out fuel saving, water saving and lubrication saving advancements and if not why? So why then would we consider stabbing the UP for doing it? Maybe you could encourage your local favorite RR to contact us about what they can do to help the situation. Being Green right now is good! Being Green and being in the newspaper is even better. Being a good neighbor increases rider ship……consider that for a moment. One day my boys will ask me…..”Papa, why does that steam engine smoke and Thomas doesn’t…….and what about all that oil on the ground?” Hate to say it guys, the future of steam will not tolerate our wasteful past performance. This is a reality, not a speculation. Be patient, you will learn more as time passes! Your fellow railfan and friend, John E. Rimmasch

Author:	whodom [ Tue Aug 05, 2008 7:04 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
John- Thanks much for the post. I guess we'll all have to be patient for a little while longer. I'm really looking forward to reading about your other projects.

Author:	Dave [ Wed Aug 06, 2008 10:07 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
I too applaud John and Co for their somewhat groundbreaking work in modern steam. He's managed to combine a truly talented staff and his acuity for self promotion and self confidence into a truly effective organization, and nothing much less could make the inroads he has made. I do wonder about some inconsistencies in John's thesis, however....... Technical concepts can be explained in plain terminology that people of average intelligence and a 12th grade education can easily understand - even if not the engineering behind it. Speculation is the child of lack of real information - providing real information will reduce it. Only those who don't want to understand will continue to refuse to do so. If gagging John is an affront to personal freedom, gagging his employees is too - even if it comes from within (maybe especially if it comes from within). So, if you really want to keep mum because you don't want to step on UP's toes, I back you wholeheartedly - if for any of the other reasons mentioned, I can't follow the logic. Whatever, I'm waiting with Hugh to learn the real story. dave

Author:	Dennis Storzek [ Wed Aug 06, 2008 10:40 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
I've lived out here in farm country long enough to know bull shit when I see it. If the U.P. doesn't want the results of the work talked about, for whatever reason, that's fine; they pay the freight, they can certainly require confidentiality. There's no constitutional issue involved. It's their right to enforce this with a confidentiality agreement, as John is likely doing with his own employees. Just don't insult my intelligence, and that of all the other members on this board, with corporate doublespeak. The U.P. will disclose the results of the work they have paid for when they are good and ready, and it's pointless to speculate on why.

Author:	Robby Peartree [ Wed Aug 06, 2008 11:59 pm ]
Post subject:	The UP experience
I know some people that wish UP would just deliver the Freignt. I tkes them at least eight days to move cars less than 300 miles. With the customer a potential 30 car a day user does not seem to bother them. It is really sad because 12 years ago this customer used to truck material to their yard. When you are more worried about model trains and trademarks it kind of shows where their priorities are. If the most important thing in Omaha's priority list then things truly are screwed up in Omaha. Hopefully they do keep the heritage program because they have a unique PR position. I have friends in both the Public and Private professions and they can not discuss what they do for a variety of reasons including national security concerns and proprietary information. It is all perfectly legal as to why they can not discuss their professional activities. But this brings up an issue that infuriates me with some volunteer groups. They seem to form Clicks that begin to focus the purpose of the group on them instead of the reason for the group to exists in the first place. we seem to have an overabondance of people who are more interested in themselves than truly promoting preservation and the divisive enviornment they create hurts us all. Robby Peartree

Author:	Trevor Heath [ Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:27 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
Mr Rimmasch, I have to ask, when you direct us to your web site to search for images of your first visit to Europe (I admit I'm making a assumption here but then why else would you need to state that "Those are the Swiss Alps over there")...who is your target audience? Surely not the members of this forum... as you have already decided we are not qualified to understand the workings of a steam locomotive be it conventional, 80-100 years old? or "modern", 50-75 years old?...when Mr Porta and Mr Chapelon were in their prime. Your comments in general cause me to think back to David Wardale's book "The Red Devil" and the story of the first letter he wrote to Mr. Porta. One wonders how Mr. Wardale and others would have progressed had Mr. Porta taken the same position that you have this week? By position I do not mean that of the UP not wanting information to filter out via third parties. That, as others have stated is their right as the Customer. But your position regarding the other members of this forum. I'll close by congratulating you on a truly remarkable self promoting response to a simple statement. Sincerely, Trevor Heath UP employee number 0428499

Author:	Schuylkill Valley [ Fri Aug 08, 2008 1:08 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
May I ask a question? What is wrong with the UP 4-6-6-4 #3985? and why would UP keep it hush hush, Reading & Northern just restored their 4-6-2 # 425 and they were letting the railfan's know the progress as it went along. I mean what's the big deal? It's a Steam locomotive, not a US war ship. Len.

Author:	BarryD [ Fri Aug 08, 2008 2:58 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
I didn't mean to stir up a ruckus with this question, but I guess I did. In the past UP has been very forthcoming about news of their steam program and the status of their locomotives. Goodness only knows that John has certainly not been shy in letting everyone know that Wasatch Railroad Contractors, and more specifically he was at the center of the modifications being made to 3985. We had frequent web postings, photos, glowing progress reports and promises that after the testing he would "keep everybody posted as to how well the new technology is working. " When testing started we got a few photographs showing a engine uncharacteristically belching clouds of smoke. When questions were asked, the free and open communications dried up. Now there is the announcement that 3985 will not be going to the convention. Instead of telling us about rebuilt fireboxes and lemor exhaust John is now talking alternative fuels and "green" engines: The truth of the matter is; the fuel issues facing the world will cause all of us to re-evaluate the fuels we use and the quantities in which we waste the same. UP has been very open minded to these ideas. UP has always been a leader in advancement. I think the entire industry could take a lesson from the UP. I can't help wonder what the big secret is now. Are we going to see a Challenger buring wood pellets? I started asking questions about 3985 this fall because it is the one big engine that I have never been able to see under steam and had hoped to catch it in Wyoming this year. I guess I am not going to get that chance for a while longer.

Author:	co614 [ Fri Aug 08, 2008 6:26 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
I for one am grateful that Mr. Rimmasch has chosen to devote his professional efforts and energies within the steam industry as Lord knows we need all the young/energetic players we can get. From what I can see he and his team have been successful in finding enough work to pay the bills and to help bring some innovative thinking to the table to boot. I further feel that none of us have any inherent "right" to be kept informed of any specific details of any proprietary project and that it is strictly the "right" of the entity funding that particular project to release what,if any, info they so choose. I'm sure that whatever issues (if any) that exist with the 3985 will be successfully resolved and she'll be a better machine as a result. IMHO-Ross Rowland

Author:	thirdrail [ Fri Aug 08, 2008 9:56 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
It would appear from what I have read that it was the local authorites in Minnesota that told UP that 3985 and its entourage were not welcome, not that UP decided not to send it. UP was told that there was no public venue where 3985 and its train could be displayed to the public. So, just perhaps, the wrong party is being criticized here.

Author:	Schuylkill Valley [ Fri Aug 08, 2008 9:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
I just received this in an E-mail tonight. Old-time rail cars chugging to Union Station Denver Post - Denver,CO Hey, delegates - all aboard! Union Pacific Railroad is sending 32 passengers cars and one steam locomotive to Union Station for the Democratic National Convention . The cars come from the RR's Heritage Passenger Fleet, restored cars from 1912 through the 1950s. We're talking parlor cars, domed cars, dining cars , entertainment cars. The steam engine is one of two still operating on the UP. It hauled The Denver Post Cheyenne Frontier Days Train on July 18. The passenger cars will be parked at the station. The steam engine will be parked on the other side of 16th Street - open to the public. After the DNC, the train will chug its way to Minnesota for the RNC . Len.

Author:	BarryD [ Sat Aug 09, 2008 6:34 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
According to reports on TrainOrders, BNSF is sending a train of business cars to the convention. UP is still sending their train, its just that 3985 won't be pulling it. It's a pity, I know UP put alot into that engine to have it ready to go.

Author:	Schuylkill Valley [ Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 3985 Report?
Well they have No. 844. They could send that. Len.

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