What do you think the going wage for a steam qualified engine crew is these days? I know many of us would pay to do what we do, but for a commercial operation, what do you think a wage for these skills is in this day and age? I would think it's gotta be well north of $18 and hour, depending on qualification and "Seniority".

Most wage rates are dependent on your location. Obviously you'll make more in New York City than you would in Montana.

However, there's an easy way to determine what your state thinks the proper wage is. Simply refer to the state's Prevailing Wage Rates for construction projects.

Montana's prevailing wage rates can be found here:
http://erd.dli.mt.gov/laborstandard/pre ... urrent.asp

Heavy and Highway Construction would be the section you're looking for

A locomotive operator is considered a Group 2 Power Equipment Operator.

The 2008 prevailing wage rates are as follows:
Heavy Construction: base of $21.99 plus fringe benefits worth $8.55
Highway Construction: base of $22.48 plus fringe benefits worth $8.00

Obviously that's based on a diesel industrial locomotive, but steam should be at least the same, if not more due to the added complexity and skills required.

If it is any help and you are near by me I'd do it for free!

I always wondered what those in the steam preservation industry make and if trying to knock on doors/beg for a position in one of the few preservation oriented shops where a guy could earn a living would be a good idea or not for some one who is young, full of enthusiasm. However I would tend to think from what I have seen is that the market for these types of individuals would be kept rather depressed by guys nearing or in retirement age who have the means to work a job they love for little to no money with out having to worry about raising a family, buying a house or other stuff. The other side of it I could see since their are so few positions available is it attracting the starving artist type of guy who doesn't mind living on poverty wages to do what he absolutely loves.

I have heard from a few people who went to work for both the Grand Canyon RR and I think Cumbers and Toltec railroad and from what I remember what ever the wage was it was lower than what they needed to comfortably live in both areas.

If I am wrong about my ascertains here and a group has a position open in the US Northeast, for a enthusiastic young guy who has a degree in mechanical engineering, currently works on large scale power boilers, is very mechanically inclined, semi competent at machining, has built several model steam engines, and likes getting his hands dirty working on steam feel free to send me an email, I would love to explore possibilities of working with you. :)

Adam

I think we'd all pay to do what we do, but what is "Full Time Paid Staff" worth in this day and age? If your certified, it's like having a degree, no? Not like I can go down to my local ITT Tech and become a certified steam engineer. Not only is it specialized labor, it's a dying art and those that can are few and far between. If a railroad were to decide to put on paid staff, do those with the time and qualifications deserve more? I should certainly think so. I have no problem volunteering and love it. My question is what is this skill worth in this day and age.

You ask what any skill is worth? Ultimately it is worth what revenue it contributes to the enterprise employing the person with that skill at the upper end. If it is a for profit enterprise, it must be less than the revenue it contributes.

Why are so many rail museums staffed by volunteers? Because the cost of maintaining and operating the track and equipment exceed the revenue derived therefrom. So, the volunteers aren't contributing to revenues, just mitigating losses.

To clarify where Mr. Maxwell is coming from, in the State of Montana on, non-FRA governed operations, locomotive boiler operators are required to possess a traction engineers license. To attain this requires 480 hours of documented time working around a traction or similar boiler. There does not appear to be any changes forthcoming on this issue during the current (biennial) legislative session. This also leave any steam operators very hard pressed to find legally qualified help.

The discussion has been interesting. I suppose it would be more useful to know the relative wages of peer operations with paid staff. I could elaborate, but this is the Internet, and I've been one not to say too much here (although specific inquiries can be made by PM or off list).

Michael Seitz
Missoula MT

Well, that's the problem. Peer operations with paid staff is a pretty short list.

Whether that says it's not worth paying for or not is a different question I suppose.

Sure, a lot of folks would do this kind of work on a volunteer basis, but if you're operating 7 days a week, or close to that, you can't expect the full time guys to work for free, since they can't pay their bills with the warm fuzzy feeling you get from volunteering...

Seasonal part time on one tourist line I was affiliated with ran about 1.6 times minimum wage. More experienced people with more years of service made more. A core of full time, year round staff made a living, but not an opulent one. Qualified is a term which needs qualification - a regulated part of the general railway system is a lot different than an insular theme park train ride, requiring a lot more in terms of training and documentation. If the job requires rigorous documented education and experience, it probably should pay more than one that doesn't.

dave