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| FEC 148 https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=27730 |
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| Author: | jasonsobczynski [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 1:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | FEC 148 |
Good luck to all involved! |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 7:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
Tourist service? Heck, it even did at least a couple mainline trips, as I recall. Some fellow traveler older than I will have to add the details, but......... |
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| Author: | robertjohndavis [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
I'm old enough to have ridden behind her in 1974 on a doubleheader from Bethlehem, PA to South Plainfield, NJ on the LV main. Search the archives for past discussion on that trip. I also got to see, but not ride, her excursion from Raritan, NJ to Bay Head, NJ on the CNJ main and the NY&LB. So that's at least two mainline trips... more? Rob PS: All these years the scuttlebutt has been about her frame being in rough shape. I don't think I'd heard about the boiler being that bad. Time for a new one? |
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| Author: | Howard P. [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 9:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
OK, I'll bite at this one... 148 operated on the Erie-Lackawanna in September 1975, handling 4 Stillwell cars as a shuttle train for "Ridgewood Railroad Days". The trips operated between Ridgewood and Waldwick, and included the famous "Collins' Curve". The LV trip was a month later, in October 1975, and the Bay Head trip (which was supposed to have 972 along) was December 1975. 148 was a tired locomotive when Sam Freeman brought her north to New Jersey in 1969. A number of "steam entrepreneurs" patched 148 up enough each year to keep her running, at no small expense to Sam. I was told by one that he considered 148 an "annuity" for him. In 1974, Sam decided (or was persuaded) to fix the tired running gear, and took 148 to New Hope, which was the base of operations for one of the contractors at the time. New driver tires from Germany and new shoes & wedges (the famous Nylatron stuff), plus other running gear work, all put 148's lower end back in better shape. The boiler got some staybolt work, as I recall, with some rather globby welding on flexible staybolt sleeves. When 148 came to Valley Railroad about 1983 (after a Springfield MA boiler outfit had made many bucks off her), it was worked on further by VRR and an outside contract shop (tube sheet and side sheet work, some retubing, I think, which consumed the $50K that had come with 148 for boiler work expenses) before VRR decided that 148's boiler needed too much more work, and it was kicked back to its new owner, Connecticut Valley Railroad Museum (aka CVRM, later RMNE). RMNE had a noted steam loco boiler consultant look it over in 1986-7 and he suggested that it was best considered a pattern for a new pressure vessel. And the tender was about the same-- a pattern. RMNE decided it was time for 148 to find a new home and it was sold in 1988. EDM, do you have anything to add? Howard P. Long Strange Trip, NJ |
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| Author: | Randy Gustafson [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 9:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
I got a look at it up on the Valley Railroad when it was being offered for sale. I had a client that was interested in it. This was well before the FRA reg changes, as well. I distinctly remember it being advertised as being 'recently hydrotested'. The other part of the story was that 'nobody ever said that it passed!'. |
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| Author: | Rob [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 10:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
Howard, IIRC, Sam was planning on 3 phases of work on the 148. First phase, which actually was completed, was the running gear, mostly tires. I seem to recall that Nylatron was used on the hubliners. I hadn't heard that is was used on the shoes & wedges too. Second phase was the boiler. Again, IIRC, "they" knew the barrel wasn't very good, rumored to be phosphate damage from operating in FL, and had planned several large patches (in the days when you did NOT weld on the barrel!) supposedly measured up for later installation. As for thickness, there were 2 methods used before UT became popular, one being a template made to interior barrel diameter and measurements made from theoretical surface and actual surface, the other being drilling the shell at various locations and measuring actual thickness. I don't recall which method was used. The third phase was the tender, with major work needing to be done there. Not many know that Sam Freeman and Jim McHugh were good friends and that friendship played part in the 1975 overhaul at New Hope. It was the trip from NH&I back to Whippany where the RDG roadforeman ran 148 light at speeds around 60 mph between Glenside and Bethlehem. I don't recall the exact date, but I'm thinking 148 last ran in 1977, when the Whippany Toonerville closed up? In case you didn't see it, posted on Youtube is the Tom Snyder "Tomorrow" show that featured 148, complete with in-the-cab shots, interviews with Sam Freeman, Oliver Jensen, EM Frimbo, the Emerick brothers, and others. The shots from the running board of 148 during the photo runby are truly unique! Link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LarUE5DFIzo Rob Nylatron, PA |
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| Author: | Howard P. [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 10:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
I think when you saw it Randy, 148 had already been sold by RMNE to the person (equipment broker/dealer) who was advertising it widely; he had actually approached RMNE unsolicited, asking if 148 was available. At the same time (fall 1988), there was another interested party from Florida, who represented a real estate outfit what wanted to cosmetically restore 148 and put it in the atrium/lobby of a large office building. Personally, I think that would have been the kinder fate for the old gal. Howard P. |
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| Author: | ctjacks [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 10:35 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
In the mid-1990s this engine was sold to a certain party in Traverse City, MI that had a questionable reputation, among other issues. He found a source of $$$ to work on the engine, supposedly from a doctor in Colorado, and started the boiler and UT work on the engine. It is probably these measurements you see on the engine today. After a year or so work stopped and the engine was left in the shape you see today. On the way up to Traverse City the engine was reportedly dragged for a stretch, causing some running-gear damage. Even at the time it was well-known that this engine was basically a piece of rust on wheels. I agree that a static display would have been best for this engine, and there was some talk way back of it going to what is now called SRI for display. Some of the other Michigan posters - such as Aarne - have posted regarding this story in the past, and if you search the site you can probably find some interesting posts. Chris. |
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| Author: | SteveRG [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 10:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
Found a video on youtube of her on the Erie Main at Collins Curve. Love the whistle and MAN she's puttin' out TONS of smoke! Enjoy!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVpHGBTjT3A |
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| Author: | SteveRG [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 10:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
Heres the correct link...sorry about the other one... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4LVqTmU2kU |
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| Author: | EDM [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 5:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
Well, since HP invited me to the party- The history of 148, as presented in the previous posts, is correct. I was one of the people, or would like to think I was, that convinced Sam to put some serious work into the old gal back in '74. As Rob related, the work was to be done in three stages; I remember the figure of somewhere around a quarter million going into the machinery alone while at New Hope. The tender was a rolling sprinkling can, at least the water side, and you couldn't use the oil tank heater; it was rotted out and you got too much water into the fuel oil. The tender trucks, which I remember as being pretty unique, needed some work as well. I made the move from Black River to M&E's Whippany River operation with Sam and the 148. I rode part of the deadhead move, backing up the old PRR Bel-Del, with a CNJ coach on the nose for braking. Once we were on the CNJ main at P'burg, and had run around the coach, I recall making pretty good time, perhaps getting up to 45 or so. This was with the old worn-out running gear. As far as the boiler goes, well, I'm still here!! I kept the engine hot and in water the night before each of the Mainline trips, and was rewarded with a cab ride from Plainfield to Raritan, where we got up to 60 or so. I rode in a folding jump seat, supplied by HP Marine, bolted to the cab side ahead of the fireman. A few years later, the side sheets of the firebox, which I sat VERY close to, were calculated to be only good for around 28 PSI. One part of the 148's history, which I have read online and which may or may not be urban legend, was that Strasburg was interested in the engine at one time. Their plan was to keep the fresh running gear, and use the boiler as a pattern for a new one, as discussed previously. But it looks like they figured that they could get 475 up and running for less money, so we can only dream about that one- One thing about the M&E Whippany River operation came to mind today. While the engine was a tired chooch when it came to Black River in '68, I really don't think it got the best care and feeding at Whippany River. (And Sam WOULD NOT allow that tender to be lettered "Whippany Toonerville".) M&E saw the tourist operation as a cash cow (it wasn't-) and hired a "marketing expert" (I'm being polite) to run it for them. Not a railroader, to say the least. It was operated as more of an amusement. I was not a regular member of the engine crew there, although I had fired the engine at Black River. The guys that ran and fired were all from another tourist operation, which had gone defunct and I simply was not part of their little club. So I went into train service, and was a conductor for two of the three years that 148 ran there. I did fire for a TV commercial, though. I'm not knocking the engine crews, but the M&E had a less than stellar reputation for mechanical work in those days. One friend referred to the monthly ICC required boiler wash as a "boiler sprinkle", it was done so quickly. And I don't remember any sort of boiler treatment being used. I suspect other corners were cut as well. To give another example as to the type of operation being run up there, by this con man, I wound up getting thirty days off, just for following the rules. One day the guys had trouble getting the "oil" to burn; there was too much water in it, one of the joys associated with burning drain oil. The engine got coupled onto the train about two minutes before it was supposed to leave on the first trip. I insisted on doing the required terminal air test, and was told "ALEX, the train must leave on time, the train CAN'T leave late!" (The guy never did get my name right-). I did my air test, both because of the law, and the fact that my runaround in Morristown was on a 4 percent grade. We pulled out six or seven minutes late. At the end of the day I was given thirty days off for intentionally making the train late. I took the time off, worked a few more days that season, and didn't go back for the final season. But with "management" like that, and the mechanical department they had then, (its far better now-)I don't think the time spent at M&E did the 148 much good. I did look at the youtube footage, and it brought back lots of memories. For all her faults, that was a sweet looking and running engine. I have a few other stories, like the LV deadhead move and freight service on the Black River, but this may not be the place for it. And of course, the two engines I learned to fire on, 148 and NHIR 9, are both in pieces today. EDM Okumpuckee, NJ |
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| Author: | Howard P. [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 6:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
Wow, those YouTube vids sure were a blast from my past. I vividly recall Rodgers Whittaker (E.M. Frimbo) taking sail thru the air when the engineer trashed the air as the train pulled into Raritan station. My comment that day: "Frimbo never flies, except down the aisle of a CNJ coach!" It was great to see and hear Sam Freeman again; yes, he was pretty ripped that we had 9 cars on the train. Originally, it was to be a 12 or 14 car train, but George Hart pulled 972 out two weeks before the trip (I don't recall why), and we had alreadly sold out 9 cars. And E-L Road Foreman J.J. "Jimmy" Lyons sure liked 148's steamboat whistle, as evidenced by that Ridgewood Railroad Days clip. He ran 'em fast, too. I think the thick smoke was the result of some "firing instruction" that was taking place those weekends. It's amazing to see what we were able to do back in the day-- and not kill/hurt/get sued by anyone, and have a great time! Lots of happy faces those days, and not just the crews, either. Loads of people at crossings, stations, etc. came out to see a real steam passenger train. Can you imagine any of this today? Sharon 5x5 couplers, plain bearings, amateur crews and more? I consider that I was very privledged to have been a part of it. Howard P. Once-Upon-A-Time, NJ |
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| Author: | EDM [ Wed Jul 08, 2009 6:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
And Sam wasn't too happy with the tires getting touched up with a paint other than Rustoleum (which I probably spelled wrong-), either. And how we got those hand picked, nicely matched nine cars the night before, well- |
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| Author: | JimBoylan [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 9:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
My memory is riding in the cab when 148 was pulled in a New Hope & Ivyland evening train to New Hope. I remember thinking South of Wycombe that it rode much smoother than NH&I 40. |
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| Author: | Frisco1522 [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 9:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: FEC 148 |
Wow, some of these stories make me wonder if God also watches over steam crews as well as drunks and dingbats. Negligence in boiler care could end the whole industry. It's a wonder the Gettysburg incident didn't accomplish that. From my view, the crews today are better trained and informed, and if you operate on a mainline railroad, you'd better have your act together. We took things very seriously on the 1522 crew. Training, safety training and plenty of tests for us on the engine crew. Nothing less would have been acceptable. The three of us who were engineers went to "school" in order to get certification. I think it was money well spent. Remember the first disaster will likely be the last one running. |
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