There are tons of railroad museums that would love to have a steam locomotive.... Just see the link http://www.lotsafunmaps.com/gallery.php?id=508

Wow! Lawsuit city.
Dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb!

Okay, let's look at this objectively:

There are, as I recall, SCADS of these SP 0-6-0's scattered about. I recall one being operable. CSRM's 1269.

This loco is in a location where people will SEE it, PAY ATTENTION TO it, and MAINTAIN it. For a "park locomotive," it looks darned better than MOST such locos I've seen in my time, including at least two such locos later scrapped after years of neglect.

Are you offering a trainload of cash to get this loco into operation? If not, why not?


Now for my default response: "SUGGEST A BETTER ALTERNATIVE."

From a safety point of view, as Frisco1522 said.... "dumb, dumb, dumb"!!! Lots of hard, sharp edges to crack a child's head open on. From a preservation point of view, at least it is maintained. The extra hand rails that are welded on it can always be cut off.

Take a look at what the REST of the park has. I would say that the locomotive is the least of the concerns when it comes to falling hazards, things to go bump against, etc.:

http://www.lotsafunmaps.com/Monterey/De ... _Park.html

I mean, they have a climbing wall, paddle boats, and a skate park, fer cripe's sake!

Frankly, I've seen some of the "sanitized, anesthetized," etc. playgrounds of the 21st century. While I concede that safety can/should be engineered into playgrounds better than in the day when many of us were growing up, I still strongly favor freedom and opportunity over the philosophical "wrapping the kids in bubble wrap" approach.

I know that in my youth I had an opportunity to mount the cabs of several display steamers and let my imagination go wild--including the 4-10-2 at the Franklin Institute and this one:
http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WM29 ... Locomotive

Would I be the rail preservationist and historian I am today if every such loco were encased in amber or glass? We'll never know, but I have my doubts........

And by the way, I take issue with the statement "There are tons of railroad museums that would love to have a steam locomotive". Please enumerate the number of such museums in question, and then rate them with their ability, both fiscally and logistically, to acquire, move, and properly care for such a locomotive. This loco would make no appropriate sense at most rail museums or station museums in the nation other than as a "generic steamer" (yeah, should we put an SP 0-6-0 outside a Reading station in Pennsylvania? Or outside a roundhouse in, say, Kentucky or North Dakota?).

.

When reminiscing about their time in Monterey in the early 60's, my parents would mention visiting this park that had a locomotive that kids could climb on. I was delighted to find it still there during my own trip out there circa 2000, and I climbed on it. And I enjoyed it. Of course, I'm one of the last products of tube steel jungle gyms on packed gravel, so you might call me an expert.

I first fell in love with steam engines at the age of 8 years old in 1957 when my parents took me to the Millersburg, PA Susqueentennial. There on a siding at the station was the 7002 on display. Prior to that, I was awed but terrified of the PRR steam locomotives that passed my aunt's house along the Buffalo line. I was able to touch 7002 and something instantly clicked in my brain and I have been addicted to railroading every since. Of course I am only involved as a volunteer and part time employee on a short line but who knows what future Classs 1 railroad executives or exceptional rail preservationists may be created by visiting Dennis the Menace Park and playing on this engine. My point is there is something special to a child about actually being able to touch something.

As someone who grew up climbing all of this piece of dead iron and can blame it at least a little bit for later climbing into the cabs and boilers of more live ones, I'm going to bite.

What's the problem here?

Mr. Mitchell has it right. The SP donated more 0-6-0s to municipalities than any other type of locomotive. Countless have been "preserved" (I use that term loosely), and though none are operable, two (1233 and 1269) have run in the past two decades. 1285 finds its purpose at Dennis the Menace Park, giving kids a thrilling introduction to steam locomotion as they hang out the cab window and gleefully ring the bell. Best of all, they don't even have to paint it blue - so despite those unsightly climbing bars, it more or less retains its dignity. That sure couldn't be said of 1294 at the San Francisco Zoo, which was painted like clown vomit until the salt air ultimately got the best of it. For being within equal proximity to the coast, it's amazing 1285 hasn't deteriorated to nothing but paint and iron oxide at this point.

In the days of sheister, ambulance-chasing lawyers, you have to give the City of Monterey a lot of credit for keeping this and the rest of the Dennis the Menace playground - designed by cartoonist Hank Ketcham himself - in existence. There's a nice disclaimer in front of the locomotive, reminding it is a "Historic Artifact, Not Playground Equipment," and for children to climb with caution at their own risk. In the half-century it's been there, I haven't heard of a single kid cracking his/her head open, so if any incident arises now you can probably blame it on your quotidian submissive, self-absorbed progressive parent. It may not be much to look at, but you can't knock it for not being maintained for what it is; it always sports a fresh coat of jet black paint, and is strangely still among the more presentable 0-6-0s out there, including those at museums.

It's been constantly reminded on this board that steam locomotives are moribund from generational memory. There's now diesel "park engines" out there. For the exposure it brings being smack dab in the middle of a tourist haven like Monterey, we should be so lucky to have a dozen 1285s. People who played on the thing as kids are now taking their own children and grandchildren to climb on the type of train they remember from their youth. Isn't that what preservation is all about?

High Five to Mr. Kelley and Mr. Mitchell! If it weren't for locomotives such as SP 2825 back when it sat in Bloomington at the old County Museum, or Travel Town where a kid could sit in either seat box and day dream of one day of being a steam locomotive engineer, I seriously doubt many of us would even be in this business or hobby.

To this very day when I go to Dennis the Menace park and pay my homage to that little pot, I see it still has life. The kids do climb all over it, and you see boys and girls alike in the cab playing engineer. There is still hope beyond the blue tin can on rails!

Compared to Salinas' #1237, it was removed from the city park and the railings cut off and is now fenced by the depot. It has been spruced up a bit and is tastefully displayed. On the other hand and up the road a bit, the #1298 in Santa Cruz had the same fate only the tender was removed in trade for the work done in cutting off the railings and now it sits forlornly in the middle of a sand box where the children won't even give it a second look. How sad when a depot or museum looking for an SP steam locomotive to display would appreciate it so much more.

Don't get me started...

#1298 at Harvey West Park, Santa Cruz

#1237 at Salinas

Somebody must take a stand against the ambulance chasers and the self absorbed parents. Children need to engage in physical activities. No not structured play dates where everything is pre-planned and pre-engineered, but honest o goodness unstructured PLAYTIME! Do you remember playtime? I've used big cardboard boxes as forts, dammed up a little creek until it busted and wiped out a platoon of little toy soldiers, and built a miniature city for my Tonka trucks using cement blocks for buildings and transplanted moss for grass. Oh how I wished that I had an actual steam locomotive to play on!

Let your children go play! Let them go explore. Let them rub dirt all over their bodies. Let them splash around in a local stream. Expose them to bacteria and pathogens so they can build up their immune systems, and let them crawl around on stuff so they develop a sense of balance for God's sake! And don't worry about it! If you lose one you can make another one! :)

We must permit the possibility of injury to learn to deal with risk as we grow up. It makes us learn to be careful and understand our actions have consequences. Ditto about exposure to pathogens and immunity.

I recall growing up in the 1960's, reading a stack of 1950's adolescent male targeted magazines passed along from an older neighbor. They were filled with articles about hunting, fishing, camping - all done by friends without adult supervision, and various adventures that such activities engendered. Technological articles including futuristic flying cars (with tailfins, or course), historical engineering, how to build any number of fun machines or experiments that could really damage you if not kill.

Sure, the world was a bit less desperate then, in a time of economic expansion and well mannered peace between wars, but we still had gangs and crime. We didn't have digital imitations of adventurous life, and had to make our own - I'm glad to have grown up then, although a bit earlier to experience more of the end of steam would have suited me better........

I can't recall what the titles of those magazines were apart from Boy's Life - anybnody have any ideas? I'd love to find some and read them again.

dave

I couldn’t agree more with the premise of “Let kids be kids”. It isn’t the kids that have changed; it is the whiny hand wringers that have taken control of far too much in life.
Everybody is a winner, there are no losers, zero tolerance, and everything organized and supervised, dumbing down education so no one fails, don’t grade papers in red and on and on. Just today I heard of a third grade girl getting in trouble for reading her Bible during quiet period. We are paying the price of stupidity over the last 40 years.
When is the last time anyone saw a bunch of roughneck boys grab a bat and ball and choose up sides and just play a game of baseball or softball? Where would they play?
I grew up doing breakneck things just like every other kid my age and lived through it. I also climbed all over many steam engines as a kid.
My comment about the kids all over the engine had nothing to do with kids being kids and experiencing something new.
I can visualize a corps of attorneys sitting on a bench nearby just waiting for the inevitable tumble or cut so they can pounce upon them and file a lawsuit.
Look at every damned thing you buy and read all the stupid warnings. They are there for a reason because some dumbass burned himself on the coffee or God knows what.
Welcome to the Nanny State guys, whether we like it or not. God help us all.

I think the original premise was that the locomotive looks displeasing to the railfan's eye, given all the extra steel brought on as guide rails. I have to throw in with those who say, if the idea is to give kids a place to exercise their minds as well as their bodies, then the locomotive may be doing a great service in this condition. If there were mumblings about rebuilding it for service, that would be another argument. As it happens, I still see an Espee switcher in the park, and it's painted and used for something other than a pigeon post. I don't want to see this as standard practice across the nation, but in this setting it works. I like the educational bend to it as well. Kids need to play at being kids, it's how they best mature and start using their minds for themselves.

The spirit of many of the above comments is addressed in the "FreeRangeKids" website. The railroad connection is that it was started by the New York mother who let her 9-year-old son go home by himself on the NY subway. After the uproar about supposed "child endagerment" subsided (remembering that New York is a "media capital" and what happens there is likely to be spread far and wide), she set up what's turned out to be a very active website encouraging parents (and busybody neighbors) to give today's children some of the freedoms we remember from the days before scaremonger tabloid TV reporters were seeing a molester or kidnapper behind every bush. For the folks who want a "hard copy", she wrote Free Range Kids: Giving Our Children the Freedom We Had without Going Nuts with Worry which is a "good read" even if you don't have any youngsters in the house. It should be shared with those who are in danger of becoming "helicopter parents". I should also mention that many of the entries in the website deal with school districts that have all sorts of onerous restrictions that can be traced to the "cover your hindquarters" attitude brought about by ambulance-chasing lawyers.