Al Patterson wrote:
Um, maybe because they are the ugliest things ever to infest the rails of our country?
I'll see you and raise you most of these:
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/diesel126.html
Specifically:
| Railway Preservation News https://www.rypn.org/forums/ |
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| Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=28854 |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
The Newswire at Trains.com updates Amtrak's long-range plans with capital investment: Quote: Amtrak plans to buy 1,200 passenger cars, 334 locomotives, and 25 high speed trainsets over the next 14 years under a fleet plan it unveiled today. The new equipment would aim to both replace the current fleet of aging locomotives and cars, as well as expand it to accommodate new business and provide operational flexibility. What we need to know: Targeted for elimination: ALL still-in-service Heritage Fleet (i.e. pre-Amtrak) cars (mostly diners and baggage, I believe); ALL AEM-7 electric locomotives. Also a probable target: Amfleet cars, maybe Horizon and early Superliners. Do any pre-Superliner bilevels (Santa Fe, I assume) survive on Amtrak? If any museum feels that any of this equipment is a potential and prudent preservation target, the time to start planning is now. By the time potential replacements are on the way, a museum or operator can have fundraising and a preservation proposal under way or in hand. |
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| Author: | tomgears [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
I wish someone would slip a line item in the funding forcing Amtrak to repeal it's photography ban. Saving an early Amfleet car would be like putting a 77 Gremlin in a classic car museum. I'm certain many others feel differently. That's why they make chocolate and vanilla. |
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| Author: | filmteknik [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
Why would they want to get rid of AEM-7's? |
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| Author: | RCD [ Fri Feb 05, 2010 12:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
The F40PH preservation Society would love to have some super liners. Since they never really made rounds up in the north east it would be a fun thing to see, heck maybe convince a short line to let us run on the weekends on there trackage pulling sight seeing trains (with F40's of cores) with air conditioned super liners... Alright I am getting a little ahead of myself here. |
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| Author: | Gary Gray [ Fri Feb 05, 2010 12:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
tomgears wrote: I wish someone would slip a line item in the funding forcing Amtrak to repeal it's photography ban. Saving an early Amfleet car would be like putting a 77 Gremlin in a classic car museum. I'm certain many others feel differently. That's why they make chocolate and vanilla. Having recently been reminded of the "joys" of Amfleet coaches on our recent fall excursions, I would like to offer up a hearty "AMEN". |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Fri Feb 05, 2010 8:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
In reverse order: "Why would anyone want to save an Amfleet car or Superliner?" "Why would anyone want to save a RailBox boxcar?" "Why would anyone want to save a Bullet Train?" "Why would anyone want to save an SD40-2?" "Why would anyone want to save an F40PH?" "Why would anyone want to save a Metroliner?" "Why would anyone want to save a GP9?" "Why would anyone want to save a Centennial?" "Why would anyone want to save an FP7 or E8?" "Why would anyone want to save an RDC?" "Why would anyone want to save a Lackawanna MU?" "Why would anyone want to save a Baldwin/FM?" "Why would anyone want to save a GG1?" "Why would anyone want to save a dome car?" "Why would anyone want to save a caboose?" "Why would anyone want to save a stainless steel passenger car?" "Why would anyone want to save a gas-turbine electric?" "Why would anyone want to save a business car?" "Why would anyone want to save an Aerotrain?" "Why would anyone want to save a stock car?" "Why would anyone want to save a Pullman?" "Why would anyone want to save a 4-8-4?" "Why would anyone want to save an RPO?" "Why would anyone want to save a 2-8-4?" "Why would anyone want to save a parlor car/smoker?" "Why would anyone want to save a 4-6-2?" "Why would anyone want to save a 2-6-0?" "Why would anyone want to save an interurban?" "Why would anyone want to save a milk car?" "Why would anyone want to save a narrow-gauge railroad?" "Why would anyone want to save an ordinary coach?" "Why would anyone want to save anything from a failed railroad like the Ma & Pa/V&T/etc.?" "Why would anyone want to save an 0-6-0T?" "Why would anyone want to save a wooden passenger car?" "Why would anyone want to save a 4-4-0?" "Why would anyone want to save a failed two-foot-gauge piece of junk?" "Why would anyone want to save a Jim Crow car?" "Why would anyone want to save a Wagner Palace Car?" "Why would anyone want to save a horsecar?" "Why would anyone want to save that replica Tom Thumb or Lafayette?" "Why would anyone want to save that old iron box car and tub car?" "Why would anyone want to save that William Mason?" "Why would anyone want to save the John Bull?" "Why would anyone want to save the Stourbridge Lion remains?" "Why would anyone care about that Rocket thing?" |
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| Author: | KevinO [ Fri Feb 05, 2010 9:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
tomgears wrote: Saving an early Amfleet car would be like putting a 77 Gremlin in a classic car museum. I'm certain many others feel differently. That's why they make chocolate and vanilla. It would seem to me that the 77 Gremlin deserves to be in a car museum just as much any Cadillac land yacht of the era. You can't begin to understand the hows and whys of the way things were done without getting the complete picture of what was going on at that point in time. To make this rail related, an Amfleet belongs in a museum just as much as some would feel that an SD40 belongs in a museum. We have already seen the latter make it into preservation. So it seems we have the Cadillac half of the story. Let’s be sure to not forget our own Gremlins. That goes for the Rail Boxes and GE Dash 7s as well. Regards, Kevin O |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Fri Feb 05, 2010 9:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
Years ago, I remember John H. White Jr. writing a piece for, I think, Railroad History (publication of the R&LHS) that attempted to explain why certain things got saved and others didn't. Among other things, he said something on the order of "Does anyone think we're going to see anyone mounting a preservation effort to save AMC Gremlins?" Imagine his total shock when I presented him, the next time I had occasion to find him, with a photo of a back yard and driveway in Port Trevorton, Pa. jammed to capacity with--by my rough count--eighteen AMC Gremlins and Pacers, obviously being hoarded as parts sources...... And yesterday, I passed by a late 1970's Chevrolet Chevette in seemingly well-maintained condition parked outside a house in a better neighborhood in Baltimore, with regular (as opposed to antique/vintage) plates....... the preservationist in me wanted to call the Smithsonian....... |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Fri Feb 05, 2010 11:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
filmteknik wrote: Why would they want to get rid of AEM-7's? The current fleet is around thirty years old, with eight younger members (947-953). By the time they actually procure, test, and get enough of whatever electric replaces them, the fleet will be by and large 40 years old. They're being used about as intensively as any locomotives you'll see out there, with their high speeds meaning they're racking up pretty impressive monthly mileage averages. Most have been, or are going through, a heavy overhaul which upgraded/replaced many primary electricals and electronics. The HHP-8's running on Amtrak and MARC were supposed to be a replacement for the AEM-7's, but they just haven't performed up to snuff. The plans are for Amtrak to acquire new electrics and downgrade the HHP-8's to a reserve fleet or secondary status, much like the E60CP's were in later years. How long did the E60's last? Twenty to thirty years. How long did the GG1's last? 35-45 years. Would they have lasted that long without the financial debacle of the late PRR, Penn Central, and government agencies (Amtrak and NJ Transit) making do with what was available? It's a fair question. And I certainly wouldn't criticize Amtrak management for planning ahead while there happens to be someone eager to throw money at them for the first time in ages, rather than waiting until the AEM-7's are constantly breaking down and having to patch them together with chicken wire, coat hangers, and chewing gum.......... |
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| Author: | Bobharbison [ Fri Feb 05, 2010 12:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
> Do any pre-Superliner bilevels (Santa Fe, I assume) survive on Amtrak? At least a few do, but I doubt they're on the list to be sold. They use the old Santa Fe lounge cars as the first class lounge on the Coast Starlight. It's called the Pacific Parlour and has special perks for sleeping car passengers like wine and cheese tastings, trivia games etc. |
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| Author: | superheater [ Fri Feb 05, 2010 10:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
What Amtrak photography ban? And yesterday, I passed by a late 1970's Chevrolet Chevette in seemingly well-maintained condition parked outside a house in a better neighborhood in Baltimore, with regular (as opposed to antique/vintage) plates....... the preservationist in me wanted to call the Smithsonian....... Every morning one is used by somebody commuting in Harrisburg-parks in the 7th Street parking garage complete with classic plates and drying naugahyde seats. Runs real good though. Find a Vega in good working order and that would be a find! Why is a Vega like a politician? Both have aluminum heads that tend to warp! |
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| Author: | robertmacdowell [ Sat Feb 06, 2010 12:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote: And yesterday, I passed by a late 1970's Chevrolet Chevette in seemingly well-maintained condition parked outside a house in a better neighborhood in Baltimore... You east-coasters... you see ALL those cars around California. I mean, when I had my Datsun 210 (we're talking 2006 here) I knew of at least a dozen others just in Piedmont and Alameda. But when I drove it back to Michigan, it was the ONLY ONE I ever saw. I had half a mind to drive it in the Woodward Dream Cruise... but I was afraid rotten egg might damage 25 year old paint. As for preserving Amfleet... we have enough trouble with people griping about the PCCs being too new to preserve. |
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| Author: | Al Patterson [ Sat Feb 06, 2010 3:33 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
filmteknik wrote: Why would they want to get rid of AEM-7's? Um, maybe because they are the ugliest things ever to infest the rails of our country? Actually, I'm glad to see that the new administration is wasting money on something I want, along with the trillions they are wasting on stupid sh*t... |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Sat Feb 06, 2010 12:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
Al Patterson wrote: Um, maybe because they are the ugliest things ever to infest the rails of our country? I'll see you and raise you most of these: http://www.northeast.railfan.net/diesel126.html Specifically:
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| Author: | Bob Davis [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 12:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Amtrak Updates: Start Planning and Playing "Vulture".... |
Regarding things that "fell through the cracks" preservation-wise: One of the ironies of West Coast preservation is that duplicating a Southern Pacific "Commute" train (San Jose to San Francisco service) from the 1940's is quite possible, with three SP 4-6-2's in various states of restoration and at least a dozen "Harriman" coaches still in existence. What can't be done is a typical "Commute" from the 1960's: The Fairbanks-Morse TrainMasters (H-24-66) that ruled the Peninsula then were all scrapped. One might suppose that the preservation community was still recovering from the disappearance of steam power and trolley cars; saving diesel locomotives really didn't catch on until the late-70's/early 80's (perhaps someone can supply a better time frame). |
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