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| Tornado Boiler https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=30711 |
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| Author: | M Austin [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Tornado Boiler |
Click Here For National Railway Museum(York, UK) Link |
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| Author: | Joshua K. Blay [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 5:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
Are we sure this isn't Flying Scotsman whose colors would be very similar to Tornado and the same wheel arrangement? Tornado was supposed be at NRM over the winter for a repaint but I hadn't heard about a teardown. Joshua Edit! Oh my! http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?option ... Itemid=123 |
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| Author: | wilkinsd [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 6:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
Mr. Austin and others, Any idea why such extensive work would be needed, after a short time in service? I guess it's a good thing that it is still under warranty, but it still shows the challenges of building locomotive-style boilers for modern use. |
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| Author: | jcmark611 [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 6:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
If anyone hasn't seen the episode of Top Gear that wasn't edited for the States, they encountered a few problems with the locomotive along the way. |
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| Author: | sbhunterca [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 6:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
Tornado's boiler is being shipped back to its builder in Germany in the hopes of solving some major problems with broken stays and a cracked foundation ring. Apparently they're trying to get the problems corrected and the locomotive back in service before its scheduled trips in the spring. Steve Hunter Cardinal, Ontario |
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| Author: | derail [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 9:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
Have they determined what changes need to be made to avoid this problem again? Or is this something unpredictable? |
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| Author: | Stationary Steam [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
Click on the link in the second post and read what is on the website. Your questions will be answered. |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
So is the boiler under warranty? <:-) |
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| Author: | jasonsobczynski [ Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
I will be very curious to find out how one can determine that several hundred bolts need to be replaced when only a few were broken. It would seem that "a few" broken bolts would not be out of the question with a new boiler being fired by some that are still learning the art. Thoughts Mr. Austin? |
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| Author: | whodom [ Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
There's been a lot of discussion on the Yahoo "steam_tech" group about this recently. From what I gather, several of our members claim inside knowledge of shoddy workmanship. It'll be interesting to see what the root cause turns out to be, IF we find out. |
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| Author: | M Austin [ Sat Jan 15, 2011 3:03 am ] | ||||
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler | ||||
It seems the Germans were no strangers to cracking in the corners of the mud troughs. How many defects can be found in this particular instance? This photo was found in the German Wikipedia listing for "Steam Locomotive Boiler" translated here for your convenience. Tornado and 3801 mud troughs are shown for comparison.
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| Author: | Newriver400 [ Sat Jan 15, 2011 4:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
I, too, was curious as to why such significant work was needed so soon after being turned out shop fresh. Now I understand - they should have used a solid mud ring instead of an oversized traction engine mud bottom... (stated with a hint of sarcasm - they also use dainty copper fireboxes across the pond) Actually, I don't think that's the problem here - seems to be an issue with significant breaking of the stays. If I dig enough, I could probably find the answer, but it looks as though they are threaded and driven and not welded. Anyone know if this is the case off the top of your head? I did not see any report of where the broken bolts were occurring (pattern or general area(s) of breakage). More flexible bolts could be the answer. Just because drawings and specs from the original Peppercorns did show or use a certain amount of flexibles vs. rigids does not mean the designs were beyond reproach. Also, it seems that problem areas could have been repaired/modified in the roundhouse rather than the backshop. Remember, roundhouse foremen had to keep the things running, and would have done whatever made their lives easier. So many variations from the drawings are incredibly common with railroad things as we all know. |
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| Author: | whodom [ Sat Jan 15, 2011 3:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
Newriver400 wrote: Just because drawings and specs from the original Peppercorns did show or use a certain amount of flexibles vs. rigids does not mean the designs were beyond reproach. Also, it seems that problem areas could have been repaired/modified in the roundhouse rather than the backshop. Remember, roundhouse foremen had to keep the things running, and would have done whatever made their lives easier. So many variations from the drawings are incredibly common with railroad things as we all know. Remember the originally A-1 boilers were riveted construction while the Tornado's is all-welded. There may or may not be a lot of changes in other details compared to the original boiler design. I can imagine that there would be significant differences in the loads and stresses on staybolts between fireboxes with solid foundation rings and the U-type welded foundation ring seen in the photos. Maybe that's part of the problem? Matt- any additional details you can share will be greatly appreciated. |
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| Author: | Newriver400 [ Sat Jan 15, 2011 3:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
whodom wrote: Remember the originally A-1 boilers were riveted construction while the Tornado's is all-welded. There may or may not be a lot of changes in other details compared to the original boiler design. I can imagine that there would be significant differences in the loads and stresses on staybolts between fireboxes with solid foundation rings and the U-type welded foundation ring seen in the photos. Maybe that's part of the problem? Glad you reminded me of the all welded construction - that would certainly affect how things move when thermal and pressure stresses are introduced. I overlooked that at 4am when I was looking at it. |
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| Author: | Frisco1522 [ Sat Jan 15, 2011 4:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Tornado Boiler |
I'm amazed at the "trough" instead of a mud ring. That thing begs for trouble to happen. |
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