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A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the NRM?
https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=31865		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Neil D [ Fri Aug 12, 2011 2:32 pm ]
Post subject:  A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the NRM?
This was published by the UK magazine Heritage Railway:-

http://www.heritagerailway.co.uk/news/s ... nniversary

Since then Steve Davies, director of the NRM in York has made a statement via Anthony Coulls on the UK based National Preservation forum, post number 31 :-

http://railways.national-preservation.c ... 2013/page2

Neil.
Author:  Trevor Heath [ Fri Aug 12, 2011 6:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
The British press including the specialist railway press have never felt the need to put the real truth in front of a good story.

In fact I stopped my subscription to one magazine because of such sensationalism likening their journalism to that of the News of the World (another British publication that you may have read is now defunct....)

Personally I don't see the need to ship two more A4's....maybe the money (if indeed found) would be better spent on putting Mallard back into service for a couple of years.

But even that is of dubious value when there are two and soon to be three A4's in operating condition now....

As for 100 years. I was 10 when the last A4's ran out their miles in Scotland. I was standing on Shrewsbury station when "Sir Nigel Gresley" came rolling by on a running in turn from Crewe works in April 1967. It and an LMS 2-8-0 "8F" on the same day were the last steam locos I saw there "in BR days".

My point, 90% of those who saw them in regular service (or wished they had) are 65+ now and will all be gone in another 25 years.

TH
Author:  robertjohndavis [ Sat Aug 13, 2011 8:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
Trevor,

What portions of the article are not true?

Rob
Author:  Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Sat Aug 13, 2011 1:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
This is one of those cases where you can't prove a negative, but rather call upon the source for additional proof.

The article begins "ALL six surviving LNER streamlined A4 Pacifics are set to be reunited in Britain in 2013." I believe that it's more probable that the planning is still under way, and that nothing is definite yet. And as pointed out by Brother Heath, the sources that would be relied upon for confirmation are (coincidentally?) not available at the moment.

Incidentally, the forum post stated to be secondhand from Mr Davies is seeminly incorrectly linked, or has been removed.........
Author:  Nigel Anthony Hewer Day [ Sun Aug 14, 2011 2:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
Please can we have all six in steam lined up in front of Kings Cross
Author:  Neil D [ Mon Aug 15, 2011 5:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:

Incidentally, the forum post stated to be secondhand from Mr Davies is seeminly incorrectly linked, or has been removed.........


Sorry I haven't got back about this before now. The post has been removed since I initially posted the link, I would assume due to negotiations and any arrangments, if true, being ongoing.

Neil.
Author:  Richard Glueck [ Tue Aug 16, 2011 8:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
European steam locomotives do not enjoy the popularity of their North American cousins in either the USA or Canada. I feel, if the hunger is their in England to repatriate them to secure hands, they should go home. The Brits have a phenomenal track record of restoring steam, and the thrill of seeing two more A4's under steam makes it worthwhile. British steam enthusiasts need to pick up the tab, that's all. By the way, the namesakes of both locomotives in question, had some small investments in keeping Great Britain and all of Europe, free. That legacy bears a living, breathing, testament.

My opinion only.
Author:  car57 [ Tue Aug 16, 2011 6:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
No one is talking about repatriation, this is a short term loan arrangement to get all six together, they will not be restored to steam. There is plenty enough mainline steam in the UK without two more duplicate types.
I think its a great idea ...if its fundable.

Mike Pannell
ex UK resident
Author:  u25b [ Tue Aug 16, 2011 7:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
car57 wrote:
No one is talking about repatriation, this is a short term loan arrangement to get all six together, they will not be restored to steam. There is plenty enough mainline steam in the UK without two more duplicate types.
I think its a great idea ...if its fundable.

Mike Pannell
ex UK resident

I don't think that mutterings of "repatriation" has ever been far from the surface. The English want ALL of "their" locomotives brought home. They are currently trying to bring home an ex R.O.D. Robinson designed 2-8-0 from Australia. Can't imagine the UK railway press or fans wanting those two A4s to return to their current homes if this goes ahead. And the English preservation movement seems to be able to fund most things they set their minds to- one way or another!

Wes
Author:  santafeboy [ Sat Aug 20, 2011 10:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
It would be nice to see these A4s returned to Britain where hopefully they can be returned to service on home rails. They will never be made operational either the one in the US or Canada as long as they are stuck on this side of the Atlantic. The British will have much more appreciation and take better care of these bueatiful locomotives than we on this side
Author:  Nigel Anthony Hewer Day [ Mon Aug 22, 2011 2:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
Any one for swopping some S160's for the A4's
Author:  Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Mon Aug 22, 2011 2:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
You know, this all kind of boggles my mind.

The British rail preservation scene "needs" another preserved LNER A4 like we need another F40PH on an excursion train. And I say that as an unabashed LNER enthusiast.

There are four operable LNER A4's over there. All four are, to some extent, mainline-operable and have operated on the main lines in preservation. Just imagine if we had four SR Ps-4's, or PRR K4s's, or four Frisco 4-8-4's, or four SP Gs-4 Daylights, or four ATSF Northerns. We already have trouble keeping one of each "gainfully" employed in our excursion-unfriendly environment; if we had open access to the rail network, qwe'd all be cannibalizing each other's excursions with that many mainline trips in an area as small as the UK.

Now, granted, the LNER sort of got the "short end of the stick" in steam locomotive preservation compared to the SR, LMS, and GWR. The picture might be different were there an equivalent of the Woodhams scrap yard in north-eastern England or Scotland rather than in South Wales, but such is fate. But I seriously have to question the economic return on any proposal of this sort, be it short-term or permanent repatriation.
Author:  Dave [ Mon Aug 22, 2011 5:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
And, I for one would be very pleased to find an international collection of steam at a US museum. There's a lot we can learn from people who choise to do things differently than we did for good reason of their own, which helps us understand our choices.

ARE there a lot of S-160s just rusting away in the UK looking for a good home?

dave
Author:  Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Mon Aug 22, 2011 7:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
Dave wrote:
ARE there a lot of S-160s just rusting away in the UK looking for a good home?


No, not really. They have picked up a couple hulks from such places as Poland and Turkey, primarily "on spec" as prospective "expendable" steam power, but it's not like they have dozens sitting about looking for good homes. We'd do far better to just try and fish for some of those locos ourselves.
Author:  Nigel Anthony Hewer Day [ Tue Aug 23, 2011 4:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: A4's Dwight D. Eisenhower and Dominion of Canada to the
There are 6 s160's in uk some are currently runners and only two not run since being in UK
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