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Replica 1860s coaches
https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=32042		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  ARM TRAIN editor [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Replica 1860s coaches
Brent Groth owns two replicas of 1860s-vintage coaches. They were built by Henry Ford in the 1920s to represent cars from Thomas Edison's early career as an on-train "news butcher" or vendor. They were displayed at the Ford Museum in Dearborn, MI until 1984, when Groth purchased them. He had plans to mate them with a 19th century steam locomotive, but was never able to make it happen. They are currently stored in someone else's buildings in Utah. One of those buildings has been put up for sale, hence this call for help. They would like to loan them to a museum that will house them indoors and display them.

The attached photos show the cars while still at the Ford Museum.

Groth lacks the funds to endow a building at the host museum, but might be able to assist with trucking costs. He has asked ARM to publicize this opportunity. His contact info is:
Brent Groth
435-714-2369
brentgroth@yahoo.com

Aaron Isaacs, editor
Trainline/Railway Museum Quarterly

Attachments:
EdisonCars_0004.jpg
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EdisonCars_0002.jpg
EdisonCars_0002.jpg [ 248.95 KiB | Viewed 7166 times ]
Author:  Frisco1522 [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 6:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
Leviathon?
Author:  Dave [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 6:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
Has anybody talked to the LEVIATHAN guy? Golden Spike NHS is the only other practical possibility that comes to mind. Maybe Nevada State...........but they have real stuff.

dave
Author:  Stephen Hussar [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 6:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
Sounds like the owner wants to keep the coaches indoors. But wasn't Mr Kloke planning to build similar reproductions for the York No 17 project?

Stephen
Author:  Les Beckman [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 7:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
Dave wrote:
Has anybody talked to the LEVIATHAN guy? Golden Spike NHS is the only other practical possibility that comes to mind. Maybe Nevada State...........but they have real stuff.

dave


Dave -

I can think of ANOTHER place. The Ford Museum's Greenfield Village Railroad! These are much better cars than what they use now. Why they weren't kept for that railroad is beyond me, but perhaps they left before that railroad was up and running.

Les
Author:  wilkinsd [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 7:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
Les,

I think they did use them, at least once. There's a photo in an older Trains magazine showing the Mason Bogie pulling the long coach in the snow. At the time the Mason was done up like an 1870s/1880s locomotive, and with the coach, it looked like a Currier & Ives print recreated in real-life.
Author:  Bob Davis [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 8:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
The 1860's replica coaches might be useful for special events at the Henry Ford Greenfield Village, but the current open-bench cars (rather like the summer streetcars in New England) give visitors a better view as they circle the property. I haven't been to Disneyland lately, but I think the keepers of the Magic Kingdom have come to a similar conclusion.
Author:  Les Beckman [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 8:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
David and Bob -

Thanks. Would be nice to see them on occassion, behind the Mason Bogie or the faux 4-4-0.

Les
Author:  Chris Salmonson [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 8:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
Those cars look like wood cars, but sure aren't built like a typical piece of serviceable rolling stock. They are more like movie props. Henry wanted them to look pretty. They do look pretty.
Author:  mspetersen [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 8:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
The Coaches being built by Dave Kloke at this time are for Leviathan to pull, not for Lyon. That's not to say that he wouldn't build coaches for anyone else to use.
Author:  Dave Sutter [ Sun Sep 11, 2011 8:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
The cars look very nice and would look very good on static display somewhere. Operationally they lack a strong backbone (read center and side sills) to make them useful in operation.
Author:  ARM TRAIN editor [ Mon Sep 12, 2011 3:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
According to their owner, the cars are accurate replicas with the proper sills and underframe for operation.
Aaron Isaacs, editor
Trainline/Railway Museum Quarterly
Author:  Dave [ Mon Sep 12, 2011 3:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
Well, there's operation and there's OPERATION. Also, let's bear in mind the average coach in 1860 went into the shops for overhaul every two years or so. If these cars were built to correct era plans, they'd likely be historically correct maintenance nightmares by today's standards as well. probably would do fine in occasional demonatration service if Aaron's information is accurate, maybe more if beefed up with some additional metal down the center connecting draft gear end to end.

dave
Author:  wilkinsd [ Mon Sep 12, 2011 4:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
This does beg the question about the third coach that was in this train set, but remained at the museum. Is it "original?" It was lettered as a Bangor & Aroostook car last time I visited the museum. I assume it was rescued and "restored" to be used along with the recreations.
Author:  Chris Salmonson [ Mon Sep 12, 2011 8:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Replica 1860s coaches
The winter photo shoot with the Torch Lake appears to have a different coach than the replica coaches.

RR Picture Archives has a picture of it, though it is incorrectly labeled:

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=475420
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