This is not strictly preservation as such, but perhaps there is a germ of an idea we can use:

http://www.greattrainraid.com/

Of particular interest is the non-operating replica of a B&O "Dutch Wagon" to be used in this:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... 71&theater

Based on newspaper stories and photos that appeared locally, this replica is made of steel, and is about 90% full size. The wheels do have flanges.

Could this be a way to "see" a New York Central 4-6-4 (or other extinct engine) in full scale? I seem to recall that the Reading did something along these lines as a publicity exhibit in Atlantic City back in the 1920s.

Most important question: Would this be worth doing, and if so, under what conditions?

As an active Civil War reenactor, I would respectfully disagree with the statement that this is not "Preservation". I plan on attending the event, although maybe as spectator rather than in uniform. As a number of rail preservation organizations have learned from experience, tying in with "Living History" groups can result in very sucessful special events (and revenues generated thereof)

90%? I would say more like 3/4 scale..(75% the size of the original)
noticeably smaller than a 4-4-0 of the 1860's.

http://www.poconohistory.com/images/his ... rTrain.jpg

http://www.historycentral.com/railroad/ ... ncord.html

but still, cool idea..
although I am concerned people are going to get the wrong impression about what Civil War era railroads looked like..the replica really downplays the grandeur..brings it down a bit IMO..

Scot

oh dear..people are confused already.
its already being described as a "full size replica"


from: http://tinyurl.com/3vngw3u

There is really nothing wrong with the model itself..except it isnt full size, and it isnt a replica..its more of a..caricature. People are going to think its historically accurate though..which to me is regretful.

Scot

Scot, It's actually a fairly accurate representation of an early 1850's B&O "Dutch Wagon" 4-4-0. Probably closer to 3/4 or 7/8 scale, but all in all, not bad. Study the historic photos of the type. It would be great if the B&O Museum would have loaned the "Memnon", the "Davis Camel", or No. 25 to be towed down Rt. 11, but what are the chances of that happening? Plus, to be truly authentic you'd need to tear up all the asphalt paving and raze every building between Middletown and Strasburg that was built since 1861. The goal in living history is to give an "impression" of people & events in the past. Civil War battles are reenacted with a fraction of the troops that were there in the actual events. Many of them are still pretty damn impressive, I went up the hill in "Pickett's Charge" at the 2008 Gettysburg with several thousand other guys. Obeying the orders, reloading and firing as quickly as possible, at times it felt scarily like 1863. With horses pulling it and surrounded by Confederate infantry & cavalry, it'll look OK. If it gets one person interested and active in preservation, whether rail or otherwise, it will be worth the effort.

". . .although I am concerned people are going to get the wrong impression about what Civil War era railroads looked like..the replica really downplays the grandeur..brings it down a bit IMO."--Scotty Chaos

"Scot, It's actually a fairly accurate representation of an early 1850's B&O "Dutch Wagon" 4-4-0."--Gary Gray

Both your comments tickled my brain cells in regard to impressions of the B&O's Civil War era roster.

One of the things that stands out about B&O locomotives in this era are the relatively "drab" painting and finishing practices (at least for freight power), as compared with other roads of the time. This was particularly notable on the road's roster of Winans Camels, which were overall painted green, relieved only by letters and numbers on the tender.

Another interesting thing is how "modern" the roster looks in its proportions of locomotive types. In this era, many roads would be dominated by an assortment of 4-4-0s, which would be in general or dual service. On the B&O, the roster is largely made up of various 0-8-0s, heavy drag engines for all that coal traffic that ran on the road even then. The 4-4-0s were in a relative minority, and shared their passenger services with 4-6-0s in mountainous country; the latter also worked in fast freight service, notably on the oyster trains of the later part of the 19th century. If you replace in your mind the 0-8-0s with a mixture of 2-10-2s and 2-8-8-0s, the 4-6-0s with 2-8-2s and 4-8-2s, and the 4-4-0s with 4-6-2s, you may find that the percentages of these types look remarkably consistent, particularly if you are looking at the road east of the Ohio.

This hasn't turned up in Flimsies yet, so I bring it in here:

http://www.journal-news.net/page/conten ... te---.html

http://www.journal-news.net/?page=photo ... l%20War%2E

A few years ago when some posters were saying it was going to be "impossible" to move the derelict N&W steamers in Roanoke, I kept thinking about this story. :-)

That's a nice parade float!

The guy in charge of the re-enactment, Art Candenquist, either does or definitely used to work at HQ for Amtrak in DC. I met him at least once, probably close to 20 years ago.

Experience can always prove otherwise

I side with Gary G., it's the event that the public comes to see for a glimpse back into history, not the full authenticity of the physical items used. As a Civil War reenactor myself I give the organizers and all those involved great credit to undertake this reenactment.

I stood on the hill loading and firing into Picketts Charge as Gary G. and his bretheren made their assault, the 'majic moment' was felt by all involved. 100% accurate, not quite, realistic to the public....definately.
The average public is looking for good entertainment with a mix of history for themselves or their family.

That day in 2008 was preservation, this 2011 locomotive move is preservation......preservation of history.

As I have always said "we will never be able to recreate the past as the past really was........but we'll keep trying"

I wish the reenactment great success and hope to see some photos.
TJ Sposato

Well, I got to see this replica or caricature today, and considering what some other engines looked like back then, the estimate by the builder that it is close to 90% full size could be about right. Lots of guys around in Confederate grey, plenty of horses, too.

The replica does have side rods in complete form. Overall painting and finishing is relatively understated, typical of the B&O, at least in somewhat later years like the 1870s.

I asked what was to be done with this replica/caricature after tomorrow, and was told it will go on display at the museum in the station at Strasburg, Va.

If the builder has the zip for it, I would suggest he build a tender to go with the locomotive!

Here's hoping he gets to do so.

"Could this be a way to "see" a New York Central 4-6-4 (or other extinct engine) in full scale? I seem to recall that the Reading did something along these lines as a publicity exhibit in Atlantic City back in the 1920s."--Me

I knew somebody would find this somewhere, thanks to dinwitty on the NYC 3001 thread for sharing it.

http://talesofthejerseyshore.blogspot.c ... magic.html

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_kTgwdZwhJew/S ... Engine.jpg