This was touched on in the 3028 thread briefly, but I wan't to pull it out on it's own.

Why weren't more Penberthy injectors used on the railroad?

They seem to be simpler with no moving parts, thier operation is easy, and they are still in production.

I understand that they only produced models up to 200 psi and 2 1/2" was the largest they went, which I am sure would rule out use on a lot of the super power.
I've also heard that they have a tendency to stop working with the vibration of a steam locomotive. This I have trouble beliving after using them for plowing and other field work.

I've seen several small locomotives equiped with Penberthys and never heard a complaint.


Ben

A valid question. Basically, Penberthy injectors are lightly constructed compared to the heavy bronze Simplex, Edna and Hancock designs. Penberthys couldn't put up with the hard, constant duty cycle of mainline steam. They tend to get hot and then won't pick up a feed. On old Penberthys which have been taken apart and put back together a hunded times, the threads strip out or leak. A small piece of trash in the water line will stall them. There's a reason a 2 inch Penberthy weighs six or seven pounds and a 2 inch Hancock weighs 35 or 40. Heavy threads, massive couplings, big delivery jets etc. Daily railroad service demands a robust injector. That said, for tourist service, big Penberthys would be sufficient for shorter runs and occasional operation. They were used in small mills and factories, as well as laundries and steam tractors, but when your tractor stops running, it's not as big a problem as when a train is left stranded out on the main.

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I seem to remember that 4449 has a fireman's side Pemberthy for water level maintenance. A rather large one I remember.

The Gramlings use a pair of Penberthys on 126. When we had it here at TVRM, they had no problem picking up and were real user friendly. For use on smaller locomotives like this, especially where many people experienced or inexperienced with steam operate it, it's a great application. They seemed to be easier to use than traditional locomotive injectors, where it would be easy for new users to start injector too fast and it not pick up. But for applications on anything much larger than that, I don't know that I'd trust them as much.

Kyle

I have only seen one of these....and it was in the stored old steam engine junk pile at Glover Machine Works, I think about a 3/4" size if memory serves. Another oddball one is the Hancock Inspirator made for stationary boilers which is an H-shaped casting with no integral valves, I bought one from a little 0-4-0T steel mill mule that was being scrapped a few years back.

Any idea what the capacity and pressures for the 2" Schutte might be?

dave

We use penberthys on both 110 and 1. 110 has (2) 1 1/2 inch injectors and no. 1 has a 1 1/4 inch and a 1 inch. Never haven any problems with them even on our 50 mile excursions. We can get them to operate as low as 30psi. They are available to operate at different pressures, so if you plan on using one in higher pressures make sure it is the right one.

Travis

A belated thanks for everyone for there advise.

Kelly, thanks for the heads up on the workmanship. Never had anything but luck new 3/4 injectors (nothing like a new injector), but didn't realize they left such room for user error.

Travis, talked to somebody from your group (and older gentleman was it you?) at Owosso when I spied those big Penberthys. Glad to know your still having success.


Thanks Again,

Ben

I use (2) 1-/2" and (2) 3-/8" Penberthy's on my 15" Sandley engines. They have been fairly dependable. I have to experiment with different NEW internal parts to sometimes get a working injector to 100%. The issue I see eventually is that the overflow starts to dribble a bit when it is working, I think that is an overflow check that doesn't seat very well.

That is the part I am not familiar with removing or finding a good way to lap it in-place. I need to become a bit more knowledgable with maintaining the injectors I have and solving the ocassional drip.

No one has discussed how efficient these alternatives are. That is, what is the steam consumption rate per gallon of feed? Also, what is the rate of feed? A road locomotive needs to move a lot of water fast, as demand varies.