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| "The Train" https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3235 |
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| Author: | Thomas Manz [ Sun May 26, 2002 11:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | "The Train" |
I saw the film "The Train" again last weekend. It always impressed me as possibly the most realistic railroad movie made under the Hollywood system. But...there is a scene where Burt Lancaster is in the shop working to replace a burned out bearing on a locomotive rod. It is lifted by an overhead crane and moved toward the loco, then Burt appears to grab the rod, carry it and set it in place all by himself. I know Burt was an athletic guy, but was that physically possible? If it was a solid rod, no? What about hollow rods? How common were these, in the US, France or anywhere? tmanz@afo.net |
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| Author: | Dennis Hogan [ Sun May 26, 2002 4:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: "The Train" |
Not sure about the weight of the rod. Burt Lancaster worked in the circus early in his career, I think. He was physically fit. I do know the shop and yard area in the early scenes of the film were slated for retirement and demolition anyway by the French Railways. Perhaps this correlated with the air raid scene. > I saw the film "The Train" again > last weekend. It always impressed me as > possibly the most realistic railroad movie > made under the Hollywood system. But...there > is a scene where Burt Lancaster is in the > shop working to replace a burned out bearing > on a locomotive rod. It is lifted by an > overhead crane and moved toward the loco, > then Burt appears to grab the rod, carry it > and set it in place all by himself. > I know Burt was an athletic guy, but was > that physically possible? If it was a solid > rod, no? What about hollow rods? How common > were these, in the US, France or anywhere? denmeg_hogan@msn.com |
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| Author: | Richard [ Sun May 26, 2002 5:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: "The Train" |
Then there are the wreck scenes in "Von Ryan's Express", where retired steam locomotives were supposedly demolished in carefully staged crashes and explosion. I particularly remember the moment when some Nazi opens the rear door of the train and sees the last second of an approaching locomotive on the same track. Of course, there are the cinematic turkeys too, like the one with Richard Harris and Sophia Loren, about a train loaded with diseased passengers. The final big wreck scene is a pair of cheap Rivarossi HO ALCO RS-3's being driven off an obviously modeled bridge. Can't remember the name of that loss, thank goodness. glueck@saturn.caps.maine.edu |
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| Author: | Alan Walker [ Sun May 26, 2002 6:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | "The Great Locomotive Chase" |
Of course, there's also "The Great Locomotive Chase" by Walt Disney. Aside from a handful of discrepencies such as the LaFayette standing in as the locomotive Yonah, a scene with a couple of steel B & O box cars, an air brake pump visable in one shot and the mock up of the tunnel at Tunnel Hill it is about as accurate as such a movie could be made at the time. The Yonah was actually a kettle type 4-4-0 and there were no steel cars in use on the W & A at that time. The Tezas was outfitted with fender brakes while the General had no brakes (not uncommon in those days). Some folks believe that reversing the locomotives like in the movie was purely for show. Because of the nature of fender brakes, it is likely that the engineer on the Texas reversed the locomotive when cars were kicked back at him. For a locomotive like the General, reversing the locomotive was all the engineer could do to stop the locomotive himself. Unlike "The Train", Disney and crew had the advantage of having first-hand historical reference material to refer to when planning and shooting the movie. Tennessee Valley Railroad Museum envlink@voyageronline.net |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Sun May 26, 2002 7:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Au Contraire! |
Unlike "The > Train", Disney and crew had the > advantage of having first-hand historical > reference material to refer to when planning > and shooting the movie. FYI, Disney may have had firsthand reference material, but the producers of "The Train" had the real thing--former SNCF railway workers that actually participated in the sabotage depicted in the movie! The main event depicted in the movie--a trainload of French art being spirited east by retreating Nazis--is partially artistic and poetic license, but virtually all of the actual techniques depicted in the movie--derailments, staged arguments, disguised stations, sabotaged signals, etc.--were actually used by railroaders against the Nazis, and many were written into the script as the movie was produced upon the suggestions of older railway workers that were consulted for the scenes. If anyone wants, I can pull up articles or writings on the making of the movie. lner4472@bcpl.net |
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| Author: | Hume Kading [ Sun May 26, 2002 8:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | The Train, the train! |
You remember that show, Fantasy Island. There was this little guy (Tattoo?) who used to come out at the beginning of every show and shout "The train, the train!" I never understood that. I mean, didn't they know they were on an island. There's no way they could have train service out there. Texas Steam hkading@rypn.org |
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| Author: | Alan Levy [ Sun May 26, 2002 9:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: The Train, the train! |
> You remember that show, Fantasy Island. > There was this little guy (Tattoo?) who used > to come out at the beginning of every show > and shout "The train, the train!" > I never understood that. I mean, didn't they > know they were on an island. There's no way > they could have train service out there. Hume, What I think Tattoo was refering to is the LGB running through the garden next to the hotel! Alan Levy AlanL759@aol.com |
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| Author: | David Dewey [ Sun May 26, 2002 9:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | And I thought he was ordering donuts! |
You know, "The plain, the plain!" Personally I'd have preferred chocolate. . . djdewey@cncnet.com |
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| Author: | Dennis Hogan [ Sun May 26, 2002 9:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: The Train, the train! |
At the count of ten, your train will be in Zentropa and you will understand everything by the chalk marks on the bottom of your shoes. > You remember that show, Fantasy Island. > There was this little guy (Tattoo?) who used > to come out at the beginning of every show > and shout "The train, the train!" > I never understood that. I mean, didn't they > know they were on an island. There's no way > they could have train service out there. denmeg_hogan@msn.com |
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| Author: | Alan Walker [ Sun May 26, 2002 9:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | The real thing... |
So did Disney. Also, had it not been for Buster Keaton's attempted comedy, Disney might have had acess to the actual locomotives. Originally, the Nashville, Chattanooga and St. Louis Railway had offered to allow Keaton to use the actual locomotive-that is until they learned that Keaton intended to make the movie a comedy. Quite understandibly, the railroad found nothing comedic about the whole thing and refused to allow the locomotive to be used for movies. As for the rest of the filmography, it was done on a working railroad in northeastern Georgia. I can dig information from the files that I have on that. Also, knowing how Disney did his credits, it is possible that many of the supporting railroad characters (such as the section gang or raiders Knight and Brown) were possibly railroad employees. Also, the freight cars that were wrecked and burned were actual cars, not models. All of the railroad properties used in the movie, other than the replicated depots and tunnel were actually working facilities. The wrecking methods used were also true to the ones that Andrews and his raiders employed. Therefore, while "The Train" used existing equipment and reflected quite accurately railroading in wartime Europe, Disney was able to produce a product with pretty much equal accuracy and quality, especially when one considers that he was handicapped by having to reproduce railroading of more than a century earlier. Tennessee Valley Railroad Museum envlink@voyageronline.net |
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| Author: | Alan Walker [ Sun May 26, 2002 9:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Buster Keaton... |
I suppose that the above is why I have such a low opinion of Buster Keaton. He may have been the master of comedy that others consider him to be. However, there was nothing comic about the Civil War and that was fairly recent history at that time. That was likely the reason that the railroad reacted so angrily when they learned that Keaton's movie was going to be a comedy. Tennessee Valley Railroad Museum envlink@voyageronline.net |
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| Author: | Mike Shirk [ Mon May 27, 2002 12:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: The real thing... |
Just recently while late night channel surfing, I stumbled upon a b/w documentary on the Disney Channel on the making of the "Great Locomotive Chase," narrated by Fess Parker. It's a great behind the scenes look, showing the Disney crew planning, preparing the locos, scouting locations for filming, constructing falsefront buildings on location, etc. Check the cable guide lisitings as Disney seems to re-run a lot of these old programs as late night filler. mas2102@ix.netcom.com |
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| Author: | Dave [ Mon May 27, 2002 7:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | "our hospitality" |
Check out the Keaton classic "Our Hospitality" before consigning his work to the scrap pile. It contains some of the most humourous early railroading scenes I have ever seen. Dave irondave@bellsouth.net |
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| Author: | Dick [ Mon May 27, 2002 10:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | "Railrodder" |
I've always enjoyed Buster Keaton's "Railrodder", and wonder if it's probably the last film he ever did. |
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| Author: | Bill Burns [ Mon May 27, 2002 9:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Looks like he did 7 more after that one... |
...and many compilations were done after his death in 1966. Buster Keaton filmography, etc. bilburns1313@ameritech.net |
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