Railway Preservation News :: View topic - Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.

The clerestory windows seem to be gone.

Air conditioning was added. What does the term "Ice activated" mean in the description of the car?

Remember car #1361? The clerestory glass was intact...

When the railroad rebuilt the exterior of the cars and deleted the arch windows, the interior windows stayed in place, while the outer ones were removed and discarded. You could still plainly see the arch windows on the interior. The 309 at IRM is like this, while the 308 had the interior windows deleted as well.

A minor correction, though, on CA&E 308 at IRM: all of the CA&E wood cars from 10 up to 308 were built with only single-sash arched windows.

I suspect that this is how the 234 was built, though, judging from the photo at http://www.irm.org/gallery/IT234/aaa - note that the window shade tracks are designed so that the shades would always cover the upper sash from the inside, and the fixtures for attaching the shade mechanisms are mounted in the same location as on CA&E 308.

Author:	FLO [ Sat Dec 03, 2011 3:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
I was browsing photos this morning and came across this set. Below are a two photos of the Illinois Traction car, Champaign, built by the Danville Car Company (Danville, IL). A brief history of the car is also attached. (These prints were purchased back in the 80's from a friend and traction fan, D. Dietrich). The older photo reveals a gorgeous wood car, and the second shows how it was modernized with steel. Knowing nothing about how this modernization was accomplished, I am curious, does any of the original finish carpentry remain under the later steel cladding? Or was all of that nice woodwork scrapped? I wonder if they used some of the local Illinois oak in its construction? I see that the Champaigne (Illinois Terminal #234) survives at Illinois Railway Museum (photo link). Do we have any other surviving examples of cars from the Danville Car Company that exist in their original, unmodernized (all wood) condition? Thanks.

Author:	wilkinsd [ Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
The 234 is the sole survivor from the Danville Car Co. With regard to the 234, it was sheathed in steel. The wood car is underneath. The interior is fairly intact though the wood paneling on the interior was painted over by the IT.

Author:	filmteknik [ Sat Dec 03, 2011 11:11 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
Regarded the gas range noted, were they filling tanks with compressed coal gas? Steve

Author:	railfan44 [ Sat Dec 03, 2011 11:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
In comparing the pictures it is interesting in the older picture the car is labeled Champaign and "Sleeping Car" and the two cars ahead of it are sleeping cars. Common practice seemed to be to add steel sheeting over the wood cladding sometimes screwed/nailed right to it. This added little structural strength so the truss rods remain as do all the wood structural pieces including the corner posts. The original trucks remain (and do today). Air conditioning was added. What does the term "Ice activated" mean in the description of the car? Are the upper oval colored glass windows that were blanked out inside and outside still there? It's hard to tell from the picture on the IRM website (link below). What a find if they were. The clerestory windows seem to be gone. http://www.irm.org/gallery/IT234/aaa

Author:	weekendrailroader [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 12:09 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
railfan44 wrote: The clerestory windows seem to be gone. I wouldn't be so sure about that, Marty. Just because air conditioning ducts were added on the original roof and covered with a new false roof doesn't mean that the windows were removed. Remember car #1361? The clerestory glass was intact, having just been covered with some aluminum sheets before the car was modernized. Those railroad employees who worked on the wood cars had to be artists, and I can't help but wonder if, when they were told to modernize the old wooden cars, they decided to leave the beautiful original windows in place, in hopes that they might somehow be preserved in the future. If walls could talk...

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Author:	filmteknik [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 12:47 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
Ice Activated air conditioning means there's an insulated bunker or bunkers under the car into which large blocks of ice were placed. Water is sprayed over the ice and the ice water circulates through cooling coils over which air is blown. It was one of many passenger car A/C systems though naturally it was a better fit for northern climates. It may sound crazy but remember the infrastructure for furnishing ice for ice-cooled "reefers" was present during this time. Steve

Author:	Brian Norden [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 12:47 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
railfan44 wrote: Air conditioning was added. What does the term "Ice activated" mean in the description of the car? Marty and others, "Ice activated" air conditioning is the early style when blocks of ice were loaded into compartments under the car and air circulated over the blocks and into the car. This was commonly used for air conditioning installed in the early 1930s. Subsequently, installations were made with various mechanical systems and even the steam injection system.

Author:	railfan44 [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 12:50 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
weekendrailroader wrote: Remember car #1361? The clerestory glass was intact... Note: Northern Pacific Railway #1361, Pullman 1915, Deluxe Coach is at the Northwest Railway Museum awaiting restoration and I remember finding only some of the clerestory glass. Conversely San Diego & Arizona Eastern #175, also Pullman 1915, Combination Coach, Baggage Car, and Caboose at Orange Empire Railway Museum has all its upper window colored glass covered over from the outside but right there on the inside. It has a Herriman type roof so no clerestories.

Author:	Frank Hicks [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 8:23 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
The original roof structure of the 234 is essentially intact, though I'm not sure whether the original clerestory glass itself is intact or was swapped out for panels. The car's project manager for years at IRM theorized that the IT didn't even replace all of the canvas when they rebuilt the car's roof. Note in the later photo of the car that the seams in the canvas (still evident) conform to the shape of the original clerestory, suggesting that new canvas on the raised hip sections may have simply been pieced in.

Author:	DBH [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 10:35 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
Being from near Danville IL. I have heard that the "Danville Car Co. was located where GM built a foundry that operated till about 10 years ago. The remains of the foundry can be seen at the G Street exit off I-74 on the north side of the road. Dave H.

Author:	Phil Raynes [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 5:10 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
While I cannot tell if the curved stained glass windows of #234 are intact from the photos on the museum website, Rockhill Trolley Museum's CA&E #315 still has its windows, and they are being uncovered and refurbished as part of its restoration. Hopefully this link will show a photo of that restoration: http://www.rockhilltrolley.org/node/1085 Perhaps there is still hope!

Author:	wilkinsd [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 8:29 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
Phil, Not to nitpick but CA&E cars like the 315 had inner and outer arched windows. When the railroad rebuilt the exterior of the cars and deleted the arch windows, the interior windows stayed in place, while the outer ones were removed and discarded. You could still plainly see the arch windows on the interior. The 309 at IRM is like this, while the 308 had the interior windows deleted as well. On the 319 also at IRM the CA&E painted over the interior arch windows but left them in place. Randall Hicka who is the project manager for the CA&E wood cars at IRM could comment on the 234 as he has done work on the IT cars. I don't know if the IT used seperate outer arched windows or not. I'm starting to think these are no longer in the 234. I'm thinking that they aren't with the car anymore and that the window boxes above the windows are open where the arch windows would be.

Author:	FLO [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 9:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co.
My scanner is poor quality, but a zoom in shows some details (in case anyone is interested). Searched Google Books for the Danville Car Co. Attached below is a short note from the October 1907 issue of Woodcraft.

Author:	Frank Hicks [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:14 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co. [TAN]
wilkinsd wrote: When the railroad rebuilt the exterior of the cars and deleted the arch windows, the interior windows stayed in place, while the outer ones were removed and discarded. You could still plainly see the arch windows on the interior. The 309 at IRM is like this, while the 308 had the interior windows deleted as well. David is absolutely correct about the double-sash arched windows on CA&E 309 at IRM and 315 at RTM. A minor correction, though, on CA&E 308 at IRM: all of the CA&E wood cars from 10 up to 308 were built with only single-sash arched windows. While cars 309-321 had interior and exterior arched windows, with the lower sash lifting up between the inner and outer arched sash, the earlier lower-numbered cars had only exterior arched windows. The lower sash lifted up inboard of the arched windows and inboard of that were the window shades, which when in the "stowed" position still covered the arched windows from the interior. I'm not really clear on the advantages of this latter arrangement, as it would have prevented much light from shining through the arched windows, not to mention observers outside the car would get to "enjoy" the stained glass while paying passengers couldn't see them at all. I suspect that this is how the 234 was built, though, judging from the photo at http://www.irm.org/gallery/IT234/aaa - note that the window shade tracks are designed so that the shades would always cover the upper sash from the inside, and the fixtures for attaching the shade mechanisms are mounted in the same location as on CA&E 308. For comparison see http://www.irm.org/gallery/CAE308/aap for a view of the 308's interior, though the 308 has arched wall panels unlike the 234. It looks like the IT plated over the arched sash on the exterior, rather than removing them as the CA&E did, but I'm guessing that the glass itself was still removed and replaced by some sort of wood panel.

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Author:	wilkinsd [ Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:57 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Interurban cars by the Danville Car Co. [TAN]
Frank Hicks wrote: A minor correction, though, on CA&E 308 at IRM: all of the CA&E wood cars from 10 up to 308 were built with only single-sash arched windows. Thanks for the clarification Frank. Frank Hicks wrote: I suspect that this is how the 234 was built, though, judging from the photo at http://www.irm.org/gallery/IT234/aaa - note that the window shade tracks are designed so that the shades would always cover the upper sash from the inside, and the fixtures for attaching the shade mechanisms are mounted in the same location as on CA&E 308. Randall Hicks and David Wilkins make a cameo photographic appearance appearance on RYPN.