I'm just going to ask the following;
1) How?
2) Is this a joke?
And, if not:
3) Who's the man in charge?
4) Is this an existing organization?
I'm sure this isn't the first time I've heard of such an idea.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Hudson-St ... 57?sk=wall

http://hudsonrevivalproject.webs.com/apps/blog/

If they can't pay for their own web domain, I doubt they'll pay for a steam locomotive.

I agree. Skimming through the website I found sentences like this:

"When we chose to do J-1e #5344, we didn't take many technical considerations in. In fact it was based on the Lionel-link through the 700E."

I don't see this going anywhere, honestly. At least, not now.

Where the hell are they going to get a big motor and reversing unit for this thing? How about the smoke pills? Not very well thought out.

The Hudson Steam Locomotive Project is a serious project to build a new J-3 Hudson, to help right one of history’s greatest wrongs. While we are not yet an official organization, we are working on incorporating a not-for-profit in the near future. The fund-raising and construction is a multi-year project and we honestly do not expect to have an operating locomotive within the next decade at least.

All are welcome to sign up for the website and “Like” our Facebook. Our main task at this time is to see if there is enough interest to determine if undertaking such a project is worth it. If you have a constructive opinion on how this goal should be achieved we are more than willing to consider your input. We after all are not yet a formal group, so we can change and finalize plans in order to prepare in the best way for when and if this group formally incorporates.

We know that in July we decided to build a J-1e. This decision was made solely from a marketing standpoint, as we figured the locomotive’s familiarity courtesy of Lionel would be a help from a publicity standpoint, as we are sure of your familiarity with the famous 700E and its prototype. It was obviously not going to be electric. We have since chosen a J-3 because we believe it will be better suited to modern realities for operating steam in the 21st Century. Yes, we made a mistake and we take responsibility for it, but we are glad that it was made now, and not further along when hundreds of thousands, if not millions had already been spent or in mid-construction.

We appreciate constructive criticism, and remember this is only possible with your support. Again, all are welcome to comment. If you believe we are doing something wrong, we want to hear in constructive, respectful manner.

Thank You-

Stephen Trinder,
and the rest of the Hudson Steam Locomotive Revival Project.

A few questions:

1. Do you have the factory erection drawings for the Hudson? I was told they no longer exist. If you don't have them, how do you propose to construct it absent the drawings? You don't have the real article to reverse engineer from.

2. Have you assessed WHO might be able to do this work? You'll be looking for someone with extensive experience maintaining large steam locomotives. And possibly even experience building smaller ones. Strasburg maybe?

3. Do you have a plan for obtaining the cubic yards of money this project is going to consume? I know a very competent steam locomotive mechanic who estimated a similar sized project at about $10 million dollars. His estimate had 32 pages of detail.

4. You're probably not going to build a Hudson in a pole barn. Do you have someplace in which to do the work? With machine tools, a heavy overhead crane, power, heating, and on live rail?

5. Do you actually plan on building an NYC Hudson? Or just something that looks like one?

Well, correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't the specs for the NYC Hudson in existence? Things such as dimensions and other important info (wheel diameter, boiler pressure, firebox type, etc.), but not necessarily the drawings. Would it be possible to create new drawings based off of those specs, or could there be some drawings for models (like Broadway Limited Imports' J3a streamlined variant) that could be used as a starting point?

1. We are aware that the New York Central System Historical Society has the drawings for sale on CD-ROM. http://nycshs.blogspot.com/search/label/books

2. We are investigating several possibilities. To be honest the only aspect of construction we will probably do ourselves in assembly. We are planning on contracting out the fabrication of parts.

3. We are investigating several sources including Donations, Grants, Corporate Sponsorships, groups like Pepsi Refresh among others. We are looking for a Marketing Manager and a Sponsorship Researcher. I actually expect it to cost more than 10 Million.

If anyone has any suggestions to addressing these three points or anything, we want to hear from you. We value everyone's opinion.

In the other thread on the Jupiter and #119 replicas, they developed the plans by scaling photographs plus a few other aids such as actual plans for the boiler, and some basic specifications to provide benchmarks for scaling the photos. There is probably far more to work with regarding similar resources for the Hudson. And there probably are many drawings in existence for many of the accessories of the Hudson. So, I think one could develop all of the engineering drawings for the Hudson, but just that phase of work alone would be gigantic.

Overall, it is a big dream, but if it attracts enough attention and is convincing, I see no obstacle.

Stephen, I see on your Facebook page you are 21. It is great to have young, enthusiastic people working hard to do great things.

However, you will need to surround yourself with some very experienced people- particularly engineering types, foundry, fabrication and machine shop people, pattern makers, railroaders, steam men from the leading tourist roads and contract shops, finance people, regulatory experts, etc. You will need to sell them on the project and gain their trust.

You will need to work on transforming any available engineering drawings into a format usable in today's manufacturing environment- 3D math data and new drawings using appropriate, current material specifications, tolerancing methods, etc. Critical mechanical components should have FEA testing done on the math data, with full files retained on all engineering work and analysis performed.

Don't believe for a minute that today's shops will welcome the CD of old drawing scans...

Even lubricant choices are far from straight forward, although fortunately you can draw heavily from the experience of other operations. Few of the old products exist today!

Boiler design is something else... you need the very best people on this task. Again, you can't just take 80 year old drawings to any boiler shop and buy a boiler that can be certified.

Study groups such as the folks who built Tornado in the UK... there are tremendous lessons to be learned which could help.

Very early on, get an agreement re a home for the locomotive and track to run on.

I have no idea of your background... if you are not currently involved in the steam crew of a museum or tourist road, you need to be! Get in the shops, elbow deep in the grease, grime, and rust, and learn what really makes these machines tick.

Don't be turned off by the disbelief you encounter... learn from it, make yourself and your organization stronger and more credible, and you might just succeed some day. And, by the way, don't mention toy trains when you're discussing construction of a real locomotive...

And, as you learn and develop more detailed, realistic plans, ask lots of questions. You may not like some of the answers, but we have plenty of very experienced steam men on this forum.

Keep plugging away, but above all, get experience with steam yourself, and surround yourself with topnotch people.

Best of luck with your endeavor, hopefully you can assemble the sort of group required to make it happen.

Steve Hunter

I wrote up a post concerning the building of a new Hudson a few months ago and was trashed a bit for suggesting it. Now I just read RYPN and don't post. The nay sayers here suck.
But I'll post this. The Hudson CAN be made. I support Stephen and the others for their courage to stand up and say "Hey I have a dream that this could be done and I'm going to try no matter what other people think."

I respect that.

Brian Hebert

First, I cannot stress strongly enough to take Mr. Hunter's advice. Bear in mind that all of us old heads were enthusiastic young bucks once upon a time, and while enthusiasm is great and necessary and to be lauded, experience with this stuff is not to be taken lightly.

Next, you say, "Since we chose to build J-1e #5344, much criticism has arose. Many believe a J-3a would be a better choice. One major reason being J-3a's had roller bearings instead of friction bearings. Of course, now friction bearings are illeagal on equipment in interchange service. This means a J-1e would have to be confined to track that we own (we don't own any)."

Let's see... "friction bearings" are not illegal; they are prohibited in AAR/UMLER revenue freight interchange. A steam locomotive is not a free-running interchange freight car, so that is not a real consideration. To any modern railroad, a steam locomotive is an alien from another planet. Plain bearings are the least of their concerns!

As it turns out, NYC 5344 indeed had Timken roller bearing drivers and tender axles, a roller bearing lead truck, and plain bearing trailer axles.

Personal opinion here: the J-1s were the best looking, sleekest, most classic of the NYC Hudsons; the J-3 were not as svelte, were a bit brutish looking.

This falls under the heading of "Against All Odds", but I'd sure love to stand at Breakneck Ridge with the 4x5 and aim it at this thing...

Good luck. Really.

Howard P.
Certified Tilter At Windmills

Oh boy! I can see this thread going into triple digits. I would suggest you go out and restore yourself an 0-6-0 somewhere and get your feet wet. Most people don't really understand the amount of time and money it takes to out an engine in steam in 2011. In 1965 though 1985 you could find a park engine and put in some new tubes, clean and test the air brakes, apply paint and you were in steam. These days it's a whole new ballgame, building a new large locomotive has not been on in 60 years. Keep plugging away at it. You are a young man and if you pull this off in 30 years it will be an amazing feat.

An interesting point about 5344 is it was the test bed for the NYC on any improvements they made on their Husdons, 5344 got them first. It was also the only steam locomotive ever streamlines 2 times and with different streamlining designs. Therefore you could have the J1a and have the "modern improvements" that were on the later Hudsons and even change its appearance by dressing is up with the 2 different streamlined designs or non-streamlined. It would also be appropriate to add any new technology to make it more user-friendly to today's modern railroading.

Yes it is a huge project to undertake but isn't that what America was built on? People with huge dreams who found ways to overcome the odds.

I am sure that in this thread there will be many who will tell you why it cannot be done. Take every cannot you hear and find the hard answer as to how you can make it happen. I have heard so many times about things that would never happen and it has been a driving force for me to see how soon never can happen.

To all the "experienced" people here, maybe heads should be put together and give these young enthusiastic people some help with living their dream.

I hope your second 5344 is the best American Steam Locomotive ever built.

I would love to see this actually take off and happen. The English have proven it can be done and there are several more "new builds" in workshops at various degrees of completedness just to prove that it wasn't a one off.
It was mentioned that a new steam loco hadn't been built in the USA for 60 years or so- China and India were building and maintaining steam up until relatively recently. I am willing to bet that the expertise and equipment (not to mention affordable labour) still exists in reasonable quantities in these countries. Some of the Eastern European countries could fit the bill here too- especially for component manufacture. If the parts can be sourced from around the planet and final assembly take place on home soil that would make it ok. Wouldn't it?

Good luck guys,

Wes