It appears that the days of CVSR C-420 365 running as a 'pure' Alco are limited. Looks like a major modification program is in the offing-based upon a Federal grant of almost $1MM. And...

BTW, spare us any speculation about Tier II or III compliant Alco 251 engines for rail application. No such animal...

DPK

Maybe not targeted for rail (yet?), but last I knew FM was indeed working on a Tier II 251C upgrade. Remember, theres a massive amount of these engines in other uses, and are still made new. Same with the OP 38D.

There is always one in every crowd...

Amazing how the same garbage endlessly re-circulates over and over...

The ALCO 251 dates back some SEVENTY years. Hard to imagine FM spending any money on emissions certification for rail application -for a non-existent market in North America.

DPK

Yeah, and? M. O'Connell explains it on the Alcodiesel group about the upgrades currently in testing.

The EMD 567 dates back 70 some years also. So does the 278, and the 38OP. Just because its not used in every application it was intended for, does not mean its out of favor. Old engine or not. Im sure they are not looking into the rail market, but if its available, I'm sure FM would be happy to sell it.

I dont consider new engine advances "the same old garbage". Sorry if you disagree.

First you need to do a little research. There is no requirement for the 251 engine in the CVSR C420 to be compliant to any tier level. This engine is grandfathered and can be totally rebuilt in kind. For you info, that means that the current engine can be removed, sent to a shop and completely rebuilt and reinstalled in that locomotive. There is a question as to any upgrades being installed on the engine, because then it is not rebuilt in kind.

It is not allowed, as per information provided to me to install 645E packs in an EMD 567C engine, as this is considered an upgrade.

The jury is still out as to the true longevity of these repower engines that run at twice the RPMs of the original locomotive engines. The 12V251C engines in the 4 Lake State Railway Alco C425m units that were rebuilt by GE at Hornell, New York in 1980 and 1981 ran 25 years without having a new main bearing installed in them or a complete engine overhaul. If anyone thinks that these high speed engines will last that long, they are just fooling themselves.

There was a discussion on this site several months ago about the testing of a repowered locomotive on the CVSR.

The only true reasons that this is being done is, they run in a National Park and they are getting free money from the tax payers. That is you and me!!!!!!!

Without the free money, they would not be spending a million dollars on a locomotive. Current government grants are what is feeding the repower and genset locomotive market. Most have been purchased with these grants.

As for Alco engines in current use. There is currently a large demand for Alco 251E and 251F engines. Not all of that demand is here in the USA. Alco 251 engines have been for a long time and will continue to be one of, if not the prefered back-up engine in Nuclear Power plants.

ALCOC420,
I am sure that FM/ALCO produces ONLY 251F series regardless of number of cylinders. I agree 100% with your post and with that idea, I would like to add yet another reason.

FM/ALCO has alot of investment in this engine both in ongoing improvements as well as a very large customer base. To discontinue this engine would be foolish.
Therefore, I see no reason why they WOULD NOT do R&D to meet Tier II standards or higher.

To do R&D would ensure that they keep the customer base as well as meet tougher EPA standards rather than see their customers go elsewhere for a compliant engine as well as attract new customers wishing to use a ALCO 251..

Another point is the GE FDL engine. This engine continues to be sold as replacement or new depending the application. Sales of this engine is mostly overseas where EPA standards or equal or less strict.