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| What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35048 |
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| Author: | Richard Glueck [ Tue May 21, 2013 11:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
I think we've acknowledged the Strasburg R.R. as "doing things right" overall. In another thread somebody opined of Strasburg, quite correctly I think, "location, location, location". While many tourist railroads struggle to remain in the black, some are obvious destinations for visitors, tourists and railfans alike. What is the economic impact of steam railroad tourism on the surrounding community? Does it make a difference? In which ways? Which museum/steam roads bring in the best economic benefits for their neighboring businesses? Besides Strasburg, I'd probably list Cass Scenic. Others? |
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| Author: | Loco112 [ Wed May 22, 2013 1:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
Durango CO. has built a huge tourist industry around the D&S. That must be one of the leaders in the "growth that can be attributed to a steam train" statistics. Chama, NM. Even though its off the beaten path, I wonder what Chama would look like now without the C&TS. The town must see a huge (relative) impact from the C&TS being there. Golden CO. appears to be growing with and from the Colorado RR Museum being within its city limits. The 3' gauge and Colorado appear to work together synergistically to bring in tourist dollars. Others states managers must be envious. |
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| Author: | junior [ Wed May 22, 2013 2:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
I'd definitely say the EBT has an effect on its surrounding area. I'd also say the Great Smokey Mountain Railroad fits too - It's been well documented about the bad economic effect for Dillsboro, NC., following GSMR's pulling out of its regular scheduled departures from there. The town is completely centered around the Railroad, physically and economically. |
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| Author: | robertmacdowell [ Wed May 22, 2013 5:00 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
I would say that the "peculiar" preferences of the neighbors are a significant factor. Look at the Napa Valley Wine Train. There are easily a dozen wineries (which are set up for taking busloads of the public for tastings) directly on the track. It would be huge business if the train stopped at some of them, that's sure what I'd do. But somehow the neighbors got all mad at them. Similarly, Creede wanted no part of the heritage railway coming into town, even though they would have been the layover. I suspect there are also cases where a the businesses ought to like the railroad, and it really does help them, but they don't like it for some reason. Just because someone benefits from something, doesn't mean they appreciate it. (or even realize they benefit.) Cass is a "company town", company being the state park. There are no unaffiliated businesses around to benefit. |
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| Author: | ekrwy2 [ Wed May 22, 2013 7:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
Case in point: Sugarcreek, Ohio. Ever since the Ohio Central stopped the daily passenger train, it literally became a ghost town overnight. Political bologna got between the town and railroad and so the railroad owner stopped service. |
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| Author: | PaulWWoodring [ Wed May 22, 2013 7:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
ekrwy2 wrote: Case in point: Sugarcreek, Ohio. Ever since the Ohio Central stopped the daily passenger train, it literally became a ghost town overnight. Political bologna got between the town and railroad and so the railroad owner stopped service. That wasn't the core reason the regular excursions stopped, and that is all I will say about it. If someone from there wants to tell the story they can. I will say that ekrwy2 is right about the impact on Sugarcreek. At one point the train rides were responsible from what I remember hearing as an estimated extra 100K visitors to the town every year. |
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| Author: | Frisco1522 [ Wed May 22, 2013 9:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
This may be a sticky subject, but I haven't heard anything about the D&S and the citizens complaining about the coal smoke. Did they eventually realize how much the railroad brings in for Durango's coffers or was a solution reached? |
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| Author: | Erik Ledbetter [ Wed May 22, 2013 10:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
Loco112 wrote: Durango CO. has built a huge tourist industry around the D&S. That must be one of the leaders in the "growth that can be attributed to a steam train" statistics .... Golden CO. appears to be growing with and from the Colorado RR Museum being within its city limits. Not quite sure I'd agree on these two. Durango may have grown on the back of the D&S but I suspect it has long since achieved self-sustaining economic growth and is now whole lot less dependent on the RR than it once was. The train is for sure a big part of their current economic mix, but they could probably replace the overall impact fairly handily if it went away now. Like Vail or Creede or Breckenridge, Durango could make a go of it fine now as a retirement/second home town, extreme and winter sports mecca, and gateway town for Mesa Verde. As for Golden, it's an exurb of Denver with its own fully developed suite of industries, higher ed, and county government institutions. The front range has been booming for reasons largely unrelated to tourism, and I suspect the impact of CRRM is a rounding error in Golden's economy. I really like trying to analyze the impact our operations can have. I think Sugercreek and Strasburg are good examples, and Chama of course would be a ghost town without CATS. I just suspect other much larger factors are at work in those two Colorado towns that make them less useful for showing the impact of the railroad alone in proportion to the overall local economy. |
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| Author: | p51 [ Wed May 22, 2013 11:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
I agree that Golden has something going for it without the RR museum there. It has a great old downtown area, and the Coors brewery nearby can't hurt the place for tourists! http://www.millercoors.com/Brewery-Tours/Golden-Brewery-Tour.aspx Loco112 wrote: Chama, NM. Even though its off the beaten path, I wonder what Chama would look like now without the C&TS. The town must see a huge (relative) impact from the C&TS being there. I visited Chama for the first time this past September. I talked with a few of the locals that day as we got there pretty early that morning. Everyone I talked with agreed that were it not for the railroad and the tourists it brings, as one said, "this town wouldn't even be a wide spot on the road right now." One lady even went so far as to suggest the dedicated train fans really contribute to the town. She said she could tell a real train fan right away, by how they pass by most of the stuff in the front of her store and go right to the back where the 'train stuff' is. I smiled, thinking that she could tell train fans for other reasons (none of them flattering, for the foamers, anyway), too. But when the locals tell you that train buffs substantially contribute to the town, that's saying an awful lot. I think they realize nobody would have ever heard of Chama otherwise. Anyone who's been there knows it's way off the beaten path where tourists would normally go. And while gaining elevation off the major highway to the area, my wife and I encountered several giant tarantulas crossing the higway. After running over the second one (I swear, the suckers had to be much larger than my hand), she told me, "If there wasn't a train at the end of this road you so badly want to see, we'd be turning around right now!"
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| Author: | Dave [ Wed May 22, 2013 12:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
CATS only exists because two states wanted economic development in an otherwise bleak fringe area suitable for grazing sheep.......and not too many sheep either. An old railroad was handy and D&SNGRR was a nice example to look at...so the economic development package turned out to be a railroad, instead of Shepherd's World state historic site. Consider it as an economic development tool that preserved a railroad, not as a railroad preservation project that brought economic development to part of 2 states. dave |
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| Author: | G. W. Laepple [ Wed May 22, 2013 1:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
Just ask the business owners along the Route 522 corridor between Mount Union and the PA Turnpike whether the closure of the EBT has affected their businesses. That's a real time laboratory. |
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| Author: | Dennis Storzek [ Wed May 22, 2013 2:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: What is the economic value of steam to neighbors? |
Dave wrote: CATS only exists because two states wanted economic development in an otherwise bleak fringe area suitable for grazing sheep.......and not too many sheep either. An old railroad was handy and D&SNGRR was a nice example to look at...so the economic development package turned out to be a railroad, instead of Shepherd's World state historic site. Consider it as an economic development tool that preserved a railroad, not as a railroad preservation project that brought economic development to part of 2 states. dave I believe Cass was the same story. I'm thinking back on my long association with IRM and Union, IL. Back in 1970, Union had a gas station, hardware store, bank, small grocery, pizza restaurant, and three taverns. A new "family restaurant" had just opened. Today, the gas station is gone; it wasn't visible on the drive to the museum, and the owner never had the sense to put up a sign sending folks two blocks to his business. The hardware store, pizza restaurant, and two taverns are gone. There is still a small grocery/convenience store (but not the original), and the bank is still there. The only business that seems to have benefited from IRM is the family restaurant, still there over forty years later. Further out of town, but on the road the majority of IRM's visitors use, the Seven Acres Museum (a western themed attraction) is celebrating its fortieth year. They obviously located where they did because of IRM, and it has proven to be a good choice. The KOA campground adjacent to Seven Acres likely draws business from both. Meanwhile, several other craft/antique/junk shops and other attractions have come and gone. Further out yet, on US 20 between Union and the tollway to Chicago, a large restaurant was built, failed, re-opened and failed yet again. I'm sure that most of the gasoline sales attributable to IRM are made at the truck stops at US 20 and the tollway, but suspect like someone else said, the business IRM attracts is just equal to the rounding error in their total sales. |
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