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| Western Maryland Scenic Acquires C&O 1309 https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35565 |
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| Author: | bringback1218 [ Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
I've heard 2 different rumors: 1)They wanted to replace #734 2) They wanted 1309 for when #734 goes in for 1472 overhaul at the end of 2015. I don't see how 1309 could be restored in time. |
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| Author: | Les Beckman [ Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
Interesting if true. C&O #1309 is certainly an historic locomotive. I hadn't realized that the Western Maryland actually had 2-6-6-2's on their roster at one time. When I read about them, I thought that they had been rebuilt from 0-6-6-0's, but now I wonder if they weren't converted to 0-6-6-0's. Seems like a "backward" step, but perhaps there was a good reason for it. Hump power? Helper service? Maybe someone familiar with WM steam power, can advise. Les |
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| Author: | softwerkslex [ Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
Sounds like fun! Big ticket restoration - where does the money come from? Benefits: 1309 is relatively new, perhaps lots of good life left Big engine working at less than capacity means better wear pattern. But: you have twice as many of everything in the power train to maintain. Way back in these posts, I think Strasburg folks target to work their engines at 75% of capability. Anything more accelerates their deterioration. |
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| Author: | Ron Goldfeder [ Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
Can anyone confirm that the 2-6-6-2 will fit on the 100 foot turntable at Frostburg? |
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| Author: | BDrotarIII [ Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
According to steamlocomotive.com, the wheelbase on the H-6s is just shy of 88 feet. |
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| Author: | Bruce Duensing [ Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
Until its a fact, this is a glorified version of a rumor ..simply one possibility. |
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| Author: | Les Beckman [ Thu Sep 12, 2013 8:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
Has the B&O Museum deaccessioned C&O 1309? Les |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
Les Beckman wrote: Has the B&O Museum deaccessioned C&O 1309? No. As the article (written by some hack that asked them) quotes them, “The WMSR contacted the B&O concerning acquiring the engine. The Museum is in the early stages of evaluating their request, and no decision has been made at this time.” By the time the rumors reached Wisconsin, they had mutated into "WMSR IS acquiring 1309," "1309 IS being moved to Cumberland," etc. You would have figured the cranes were loading it onto flat cars or trailers already, or that it was already out in Ridgeley. |
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| Author: | dinwitty [ Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
this popped up on another forum also a week ago, seems some information is true. Why worry about more running wheels, 1218 was restored, 3985 runs, and bring back a big boy? then IRM runs South Shore 803...why not. |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Thu Sep 12, 2013 11:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
The relevant info: The WMSR is looking at the possibility of acquiring a second steam locomotive. Whether they get one most likely depends on numerous factors, including availability, expense of restoration and upkeep, etc. "Someone" out there apparently said "they're looking at C&O 1309." This mutated, over time, into "They're getting 1309." My gut feeling is that the B&O Museum only acknowledged the WMSR inquiry because the rumors were getting out of hand. If you have a Trains subscription, sign in here: http://trn.trains.com/en/Railroad%20New ... cenic.aspx |
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| Author: | Ed Kapuscinski [ Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
I can't imagine the B&O Museum would let that go. It's not like it's piece that they have multiples of (like the RDC they leased out), or that it'd be on a short term loan. Leasing an artifact like that out of a collection for such heavy use just seems very irresponsible. Yes, we'd all love to see something like that run, but I'd also like to see it around in good and accurate (to its period of significance) shape. If it were to go out to daily use, it'd be stupid for those rebuilding it (it wouldn't be a restoration, it'd be a rebuild) to not incorporate modern best practices for daily use steam. But by doing that, they'd destroy some of the historic fabric of the locomotive. It's the reason why you don't see the RR Museum of PA loaning their engines out to Strasburg anymore, and the reason why the two that were are no longer there. On the flip side, if you're going to be using something in daily, heavy service, it's much better to not have to worry about preservation aspects. This is something Strasburg excels at. Their locomotives are easily modified as they need because they don't have to worry about historic fabric. I'm sure they like keeping them as original as possible, but if a serious improvement is available, they take it (see the lubrication system changes, or 90's unextended smokebox). It's the smart thing to do for them. This is why it's really important to keep the difference between heritage railroads (or whatever tourist lines are called these days) and museums clear in our heads. |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Fri Sep 13, 2013 10:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
Okay, I'm just going to play "devil's advocate" here. So 1309 is "historic" and "precious," the last domestic Baldwin built (to a 1910 design, mind you--like ordering a new SD40, U28C, or F40PH in 2013). But she's run down. Sister 1308 is in Huntington, West Va.--equally out in the open, a little less weather-beaten. But for one number, just as "historic." Suppose someone--just for the sake of argument, me--brokers the following deal: 1308 is deemed to be in slightly better shape, so 1308 goes to Cumberland on a 25-year lease. 1309 goes to Huntington in its place, and gets a nice restoration job and shelter. If/when the WMSR ever gives up, changes its mind, goes electric, whatever, 1308 goes back to Huntington, and B&O gets back a better-looking 1309. In the meantime, B&O Museum gets some elbow room and some cash to buy paint for C&O 2705, AFT 1, C&O 490, a bunch of C&O cars, whatever. Whadaya say? Just recently, I held in my hand the sales agreement for one of the most historic pieces of railroad equipment sold in the nation, sold over 50 years ago to an operator that still uses it today. I believe that, over the years, the latter owner has put over a quarter-million to half-million dollars into the restoration and enduring maintenance of said item, but by that agreement if the operator ever gives up operation (in 2013, unlikely but not impossible by any means), the original owners, still extant, retain first option to buy it back for the original sale price: $5,000. Nope, no inflation rider in that agreement. |
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| Author: | Richard Glueck [ Fri Sep 13, 2013 10:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
On the other hand, a locomotive is in its best mechanical condition when it is maintained as an operational unit. I don't see leasing an artifact as irresponsible, provided there are standards to which the artifact is kept. Furthermore, the locomotive is leased, not given to the operator, so the B&O Museum still can claim it for static display when the lessor is done with it. Last, we need an official statement directly from one of the parties involved. |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Fri Sep 13, 2013 10:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
Richard Glueck wrote: Last, we need an official statement directly from one of the parties involved. You have it. I repeat the words of Dave Shackelford, curator at the B&O Museum: “The WMSR contacted the B&O concerning acquiring the engine. The Museum is in the early stages of evaluating their request, and no decision has been made at this time.” That was official, for publication. So just sit back a see when, or if, they make a decision and what that decision is. |
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| Author: | EDM [ Fri Sep 13, 2013 11:16 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Western Maryland Scenic Possibly Acquiring C&O 1309 (?) |
If WMSR is considering another steam locomotive, I would suggest looking at 1238 and/or 1286, not too far away in VA. More reasonable in size, and one or both have operated on that trackage before. |
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