The locomotive in question.
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| Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35907 |
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| Author: | Finderskeepers [ Thu Nov 28, 2013 10:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
I managed to find this shot of CN 2391 on the ‘net. She was lost in the muskeg north of Manitouwadge ON when CN built their branch from Hillsport to tap the iron mines in the Manitouwadge area. She’s still there, if anyone wants to go and exhume her. She’s likely in very good shape; not much oxygen in muskeg to promote rusting. She simply rolled over on a soft spot, while stopped, apparently, and disappeared over a few weeks’ time. No steam engine was worth the expense of recovering in the mid-fifties. |
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| Author: | car57 [ Thu Nov 28, 2013 10:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
There is no picture ? |
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| Author: | Finderskeepers [ Thu Nov 28, 2013 11:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
Thanks to Joe6167 for getting the picture to work properly. |
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| Author: | joe6167 [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 12:18 am ] | ||
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? | ||
The locomotive in question.
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| Author: | David Notarius [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 4:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
Ok, whats the story? How did it get there and why is it buried? |
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| Author: | sbhunterca [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 12:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
Quote: Ok, whats the story? How did it get there and why is it buried? Muskeg (soft, swampy ground) is notorious for swallowing up roads, railroads, vehicles, rolling stock... in short, anything heavy that can sink into the soft ground. Think quicksand. Not the same thing, but with similar characteristics. This locomotive was unfortunate enough to be parked on a section of track over a patch of muskeg... the track subsided, the locomotive rolled off, and it was swallowed. There probably wasn't so much as a burp to acknowledge the meal. It's a Canadian thing. In areas of muskeg, we generally know better than to leave valuable things lying around. Other rolling stock has disappeared over the years following derailments- and some of those could have been caused by the track sinking. Recovery of a heavy item like a Consolidation would be problematic. A heavy wrecking crane would likely sink under its own weight, even without the weight of the lost locomotive and the suction created as it is lifted. Likewise, jacking is impractical- muskeg is practically bottomless! Hope this helps, Steve Hunter |
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| Author: | R.L.Kennedy [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 12:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
Finderskeepers wrote: [ She’s still there, if anyone wants to go and exhume her. And then what? |
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| Author: | Bruce Duensing [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 12:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
"She was lost in the muskeg north of Manitouwadge ON when CN built their branch from Hillsport to tap the iron mines in the Manitouwadge area." What is the provenance of this "story'? First things first is my first thought upon reading this in terms of many a rumored "treasure" being essentially a folktale that degenerates into a dog chasing it's own tale. Was this found in disposition records of equipment, a newspaper account or what is this tales origin? Leaving this essential information out gives the impression of a glib statement of alleged fact whereas none are provided in any testable manner. |
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| Author: | Richard Glueck [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
I think the story could be very solid, unlike the alleged support under the Consolidation. I would also assume a support cradle of timbers spread over the surrounding area, would support the recovery crane quite successfully. The expense is prohibitive. I think finding the locomotive isn't too difficult, but you can't send divers into that soup and expect them to function or come out alive. Great story, though. I would think enough oxygen exists to do some damage, but not extreme. We know for certain of a CPR Consolidation in a lake in in Brit. Columbia, but 600' down. It has been located and seen on a television camera. In this case, we are likely looking at dark, cold, fresh water, and relatively little corrosion. Here is where the Discovery Channel could return a steam locomotive from Canada's past and display them side by side. I'd surely watch the series, but a viewing audience of 1 doesn't cut deals with Discovery. |
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| Author: | joe6167 [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
Make that a viewing audience of TWO! Discovery filmed the move of 6213 (well the unloading) several years back. And it would be nice to see some respectable programming on that station for a change (from the Amish Mafia, phoney bootleggers, and naked people running around...) |
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| Author: | Ron Travis [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
Bruce Duensing wrote: What is the provenance of this "story'? First things first is my first thought upon reading this in terms of many a rumored "treasure" being essentially a folktale that degenerates into a dog chasing it's own tale. Was this found in disposition records of equipment, a newspaper account or what is this tales origin? Leaving this essential information out gives the impression of a glib statement of alleged fact whereas none are provided in any testable manner. The story sounds plausible enough, but I too would like to know how, or if this is listed in the historical record. Also, what does the site look like today? Who owns it? In what ways has it changed since the locomotive was lost? |
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| Author: | joe6167 [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
To complicate matters, CN Steam Power doesn't make any mention of this for 2391, it only says that then engine was scrapped in December 1955. Perhaps Don McQueen has an answer in his newly revised edition of CN Steam Power. |
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| Author: | Great Western [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 2:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
Here's a bit of a story on the old girl: http://www.bytownrailwaysociety.ca/bran ... 000-01.pdf |
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| Author: | joe6167 [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 3:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
I'm not too certain about the photo and caption in that article. For starters you can't even SEE the number on the locomotive in that photo, and the photo looks more like it was taken in Stratford during the late 50's rather then 1937. Further more, comparing the photo of the engine in the article with the photo in the this thread, I see a number of differences between the engines that makes me suspect that they are different engines. The pilot, pilot handrails, marker lights, running board steps, and bell are different in the two photos. However I should add that from my own research into CNR steam power I've noticed that these kinds of details were prone to changing on an almost monthly basis on CN. So it may very well be the same engine. I certainly see enough similarities to lead me to believe that they are at least the same class of locomotives. |
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| Author: | Finderskeepers [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 8:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Anybody feel like digging for buried treasure? |
Great Western wrote: Here's a bit of a story on the old girl: http://www.bytownrailwaysociety.ca/bran ... 000-01.pdf That link seems to back up the story. I guess the better question would be "exactly where"? |
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