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The Baby Boomer Effect
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Author:  rock island lines [ Sun Apr 20, 2014 1:29 pm ]
Post subject:  The Baby Boomer Effect
We all know about the "Baby Boomers". Statistically, they are people born during the demographic Post–World War II baby boom between the years 1946 and 1964. Look at a birth rate chart and you'll see where the name comes from. Here's one (LINK).

A couple effects the Boomers will have on railway preservation:

(1) A survey last year showed that baby boomers are more generous in charitable giving that other groups. It isn't just their sheer numbers, but on an individual basis they are apparently more generous. Here's a quote from Forbes:

"The survey, commissioned by Blackbaud, which provides software to nonprofits, found that not only are Boomers the largest group numerically, with 51 million individuals comprising 34% of the donor base, they are also the largest contributors, giving an estimated total of $61.9 billion per year (43% of all the dollars donated). Matures accounted for 26% of the donations; Gen X, 20%; and Gen Y 11%." (LINK)

Some things to think about. First, donations to rail museums may be at a peak right now. When these generous baby boomers with their pensions and accumulated stock market wealth die off, you may see a decline in donations. I'm just speculating.

Second, now is the time to target your fund-raising to the Baby-Boomers types. Remember, they grew up in the era of the 30-second television ad and radio spot. Think about that as you tailor your ads. Hey, you could do something like imitate the Paul Masson ads of the 70's, "we will sell no steam before it's time."


(2) I think the current "steam rebirth" is due to baby boomers who saw the end of steam as kids and now have time in retirement to fulfill a wish to see operating steam again. Look at all these steam locomotive groups popping up, and you see guys in the Baby Boomer demographic. When the Boomers pass on, I think the steam revival movement will also diminish. Hopefully they will leave behind some well-preserved locomotives, though, for future generations to appreciate.

Just some of my thoughts. (I am a Gen X'er, by the way).

[Edited to revise wording.]
Author:  Ron Muldowney [ Sun Apr 20, 2014 2:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
I had not thought of that before, but there may be some truth to this post. I just turned 65 this year and I had never donated to any groups except in the past few years. I finally had some extra funds now that the house is paid and the kids are done with college. I was born in 1949 and missed most mainline steam. I have recently donated to the project to restore MEC 470, the WW&F, the R&LHS, PRRT&HS. Friends of the EBT, and the NRHS Railcamp Program. I want these groups to succeed and want to help them in a small way. I also derive a lot of pleasure from seeing restored steam in operation!! It will be interesting to see what happens when all of the "baby boomers" pass on. Excellent post and something to seriously consider.
Author:  Dave [ Sun Apr 20, 2014 7:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
Imagine if we hadn't experimented with open season in the financial industry and more of us boomers had not lost much of our wealth.........and many of us who no longer can afford to retire could also have swelled the ranks of the volunteers.

I think we have nothing to fear, as the Millennials and Gens X and Y seem to be forming associations that are more proponents of collective rather than individual action, which is reflected in their new urbanism and desire for public transit, et al. Besides, steam is so viscerally inclusive it's impossible to be involved with it without being caught up in it.

There are many very active and interested young people involved in both projects I'm associated with as a volunteer right now. I wish I had more face time with them to pass along what I learned.

dave
Author:  Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Sun Apr 20, 2014 10:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
There's virtually no way to discuss this "futurecast" or whatever without a politicized screaming match erupting, but I'll try my best to bring up the subject in a non-politicized fashion:

There are predictions being made of an eventual "collapse" of Social Security, Medicare, etc. Whether you believe the doomsayers or not, the fact remains that there are young people today believing it, and acting accordingly--effectively planning never to have a retirement (where we get a lot of volunteers at a lot of our operations), hoarding money as if a "second Great Depression" is inevitable, etc. The worst of the cynics will tell you that the "Greatest Generation" and the "Baby Boomers" got themselves and the country where they are by mortgaging their children's and grandchildren's futures. Even if that is complete malarkey, there is still a demographic and actuarial shift looming, from a combination of lower birth rates and longer life spans than Social Security originally planned for, and I have little to zero faith in politicians to adequately address those issues before complete crisis occurs.

Any long-term planners for whom the above at least sounds rationally possible should be planning long term for reduced charitable donations from individuals, a lower availability of volunteers in the future, and a greater reliance on other financial contributions--private foundation grants, public coffers, etc.

I actually hope I'm wrong, and just a pessimist.
Author:  Loco112 [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 12:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
Dave wrote:

I think we have nothing to fear, as the Millennials and Gens X and Y seem to be forming associations that are more proponents of collective rather than individual action, which is reflected in their new urbanism and desire for public transit, et al. dave


The youngish collectives want public everything, but I suspect they are not going to do anything for steam trains and tourist rr's except scrap them and use the money to feed the starvting masses with.

The men that have kept steam alive for the last 60+ years are all hard core individualists that are motivated by thier self-interest. They (we) are, unfortunatly, going on the endangered list as we discuss this. Extinction looms near for that we cherish with todays generation of collective non-thinkers.
Author:  p51 [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 1:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
EVERY generation is biologically convinced that theirs was the last generation that was any good. Even the 'greatest generation' was accused of all this when they were young.
That said, I've personally watched a decline in interest in steam among people under that age of 30. I didn't think this would happen among people already into trains.
All that sad, there have been news stories about people under 30 not buying cars (or even teens not wanting to drive like they used to), a sharp decline in home buying among people who traditionally bought homes when young but able to do so, far lower %s than ever before, and things of the like.
I fully believe that the longer we've gone from people remembering steam on the mainlines RRs, the less likely we're going to be to finding people who care than we ever were before.
Just like interest is sailing ship preservation declined once the people who remember them being used normally was mostly gone...
Author:  Bulby [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 1:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
Dave wrote:
...which is reflected in their new urbanism and desire for public transit, et al.


Which is really a disguised wish to be near the infernal device known as a smart phone. (I say this as a young person) Frankly, if Amtrak aggressively marketed the fact it offers free wi-fi, they would be scrambling for equipment to carry all the 20/30 somethings that can't be away from the internet.


Dave wrote:
Besides, steam is so viscerally inclusive it's impossible to be involved with it without being caught up in it.


However, you first have to become involved. Which seems to be the problem for many. How do you get people to come, and more importantly, stay.

Loco112 wrote:
The youngish collectives want public everything, but I suspect they are not going to do anything for steam trains and tourist rr's except scrap them and use the money to feed the starving masses with.

The men that have kept steam alive for the last 60+ years are all hard core individualists that are motivated by their self-interest. They (we) are, unfortunately, going on the endangered list as we discuss this. Extinction looms near for that we cherish with today's generation of collective non-thinkers.


Steam still holds a captivating power; I think vintage diesels are more endangered (at least in terms of operation) than steam, both from complexity of parts and emissions (if there is one positive to the "global warming" craze, it is teaching young people to care about the environment). If you can attract support for any project, it builds itself. Everything is a spiral, up or down. Individualism works, as long as the individualist realizes steam needs a group working together.

Look at the amount of people who stop and look as a steam engine roars by; not all are old, many are the new generation, as long as the insurance companies, the FRA, and the railroads are supportive, you can run big steam and attract the next generation; we just need to connect to those who see the engine running, and bring them in so that they can get up close, see the engine, and hopefully light the spark.

Heck, a Santa Train I help with ran a passenger car for a couple years, we had less turn out without the car than we did with it. We managed to sell out 160 seats for two of three segments, with the third segment nearly a sell out. We did this for two years straight, despite poor marketing IMHO by the charity that was selling the tickets (and receiving the revenue). Most of those who rode just wanted to ride a train; they didn't care about seeing Santa. It also didn't matter that it was December and we had no HEP hooked up to the car, just a couple of propane heaters.

p51 wrote:
That said, I've personally watched a decline in interest in steam among people under that age of 30. I didn't think this would happen among people already into trains.


I would point out that since the revised part 230 took effect, many operations have cut back steam or dropped it entirely. Could said decline be simple lack of exposure to operation at all as opposed to lack of exposure to the old days?
Author:  J3a-614 [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 8:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
Bulby wrote:
I would point out that since the revised part 230 took effect, many operations have cut back steam or dropped it entirely. Could said decline be simple lack of exposure to operation at all as opposed to lack of exposure to the old days?


I am inclined to agree most with this statement by Bulby. This isn't to say the other comments and criticisms are without merit, but I this one may be the most important one.

I've been seeing this for more than 20 years, ever since I tried to promote a light rail line as an alternative to a highway expansion project. There were older and younger people who favored the project, and a group in the middle that thought it a Communist plot to take away their automobiles. (For a while, I considered growing a beard, wearing fatigues and a beret, and taking up cigars--"Here, have a good smoke from Brother Fidel!" Hey, if you're accused of something, you might as well have fun with it!)

Exposure, particularly favorable exposure, helps. Consider Strasburg, Cass, D&S, C&T--if we went by the rule that only old heads would be interested who remembered steam in revenue service, then all of these outfits and anyone else running steam should have died years ago. How long has revenue steam been gone? About 1960 for N&W, CP, CN, GTW? That's 54 years ago, and for most other parts of the country, steam went away earlier than that? How old would that make people who remembered steam in revenue service, much less its prime? What do the passengers look like on the trains today? Are they all in walkers and wheelchairs?

Our biggest problems, in my opinion, are from two sources. One is the mainline railroad industry, with what I think is a "scared of being hit by lightning" fear of risk vs. reality. I mean, come on, how else do you explain a certain Class I that has "hell, no" attitude to even moving steam in tow on its own wheels, and which long before that had a ridiculously high insurance requirement, all because of fear of injury to passengers and lawsuits? Heck, the worst things we had happen--a boiler explosion on the Gettysburg Railroad, and a derailment at speed in the Great Dismal Swamp--had no fatalities, but an oil train derailment in Canada incinerated 47 people, and several other incidents have revealed problems in handling a new form of crude oil that is apparently much more volatile than what would normally be classed as crude, but you don't hear any talk about embargoing the oil traffic!

The second source is, I believe, part of what feeds the first. There is a certain contingent of people, born roughly from 1930 to about 1953 or so, who came of age when the automobile was very ascendant, and who thought--and think--railroads should go the way of the stagecoach. This is the bulk of your NIMBY crowd, it seems to be a big part of the anti-railroad, pro-snowmobile crowd in New York, and it is, I believe, a major part of the anti-steam, anti-passenger contingent in railroad management today, who think their business is only good for moving rocks, boards, and boxes around, and who have no room in their hearts, their minds, or their souls for their heritage, their history, or any fun.

The one good thing about this is that this group--which would include the Depression Babies, the War Babies, and the first third of the Baby Boom--is approaching or into retirement age, and may be falling out of influential positions. We may have openings, opportunities, with new minds who don't mind noting that some things were better in the old days, and wouldn't mind at least looking at bringing some things back. Consider the current NS steam revival (and that the road's top man was born in 1953, and started his career just as the original Southern steam program was ramping up), and consider Ed Ellis and the Pullman Experience.

Of course, we do have to keep the young crowd in mind--Mr. Ellis' Pullmans do have Wi-Fi!
Author:  Dave [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 9:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
[quote="Loco112]
The men that have kept steam alive for the last 60+ years are all hard core individualists that are motivated by thier self-interest. They (we) are, unfortunatly, going on the endangered list as we discuss this. Extinction looms near for that we cherish with todays generation of collective non-thinkers.[/quote]

Well, actually.........I don't know how old you are but based on this comment I'd say probably not as old as to be included in the group you refer to.......

Individualists, not exactly. There were a few of course (Paulsen Spence, Nelson Blount), but for the most part the 1960s era railroad museum was a collective of people sharing an interest and working on building something together. They garnered a surprising amount of cooperation from the industry at the time, and before the age of digital communication networked extremely productively.

Non-thinkers have been loudly apparent in every generation, mine included and "the Greatest" along with all the rest. Self righteous small minded bigots have always been with us, and we have not lost them and never will. So, how would you suggest a single thinking individual might overcome a mass of small minded self righteous bigots alone without collective cooperative organization?

dave
Author:  scarabbrian [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 9:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
A huge factor, I think, that hasn't been mentioned yet, is that there are generations who grew up with a certain blue engine that the baby boomers didn't have. The show first aired in 1984 and the kids that first started watching the show are now adults. Maybe it's my age, I'm 30, but the majority of people I meet who are interested in steam are under the age of 35. I think the preservation community has less to worry about from a lack of interest standpoint with younger generations as it does from a lack of disposable income from said generations.
Author:  wilkinsd [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 10:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
After reading everyone's comments, I feel that we are making the wrong diagnosis from the symptoms presented. While it's fun to rail against generational differences, I feel that they have very little to do with the challenges we face in railway preservation. At best we are just throwing around some meaningless buzzwords ("collective action"). To illustrate that point, let us look at some observations.

1. I feel the reason you see less steam now than pre Part 230 is not due to a generational difference. It is a cost and manpower issue that goes to the heart of the challenges we face. The lack of steam is a greater symptom of those challenges.

2. The best museums and organizations I have been associated with have had a mix of generations. Those organizations were open to younger volunteers and they let those younger volunteers play a larger role in the organization. Knowledge was freely shared and skills are passed down. The least successful organizations I have been involved with did a lot of new volunteer "hazing," did not allow volunteers to work their way up, and held a monopoly on information.

3. Knowing what your organization's mission is, and how you present it to outsiders is important. If you cannot answer the question "What do we do and why is it relevant?" then you will have an awful hard time communicating your relevance and importance to outsiders, donors, non-railfans, the general public and others.

4. The economic downturn and drying up of government subsidies (ISTEA/TEA-21, etc.) has merely exposed poorly run organizations. They were always there, but the tough times really exposed them for what they were. Donors do not like to give money to poorly run organizations. Most grants you apply for want to look at your organization's financials. If you aren't a well-run organization, especially in these times, you better learn how to become one.

5. So why less steam? It is probably a combination of cost, poorly run organization, and an institutional structure that does not encourage younger volunteers and knowledge transfer. Throw all of them in together and you have problems that go deeper than not being able to fire up 'ole 97.

6. Marketing is key, period. If you don't understand who your target audience is, how far the typical paying visitor comes, and why they choose to visit and possibly return, then you might as well just flush the money you spend on advertising and marketing down the toilet.

Finally an observation and it is not generational. Given the pervasiveness of the internet these days, I see a lot of examples where people (of all ages) confuse online action with actual, real-life action. Just pushing the "like" button, or watching a YouTube video does not replace a flue or help establish your museum's endowment. This problem, called "slacktivism" has been around for ages, but the growth of the internet makes it easier to partake in. While it is important to appeal to and market to the internet culture, how you can turn slacktivism into real, honest, hardworking volunteer hours is beyond me.

David M. Wilkins
We're an Autonomous Collective, UT
Author:  fkrock [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 11:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
Your museum should have an account with a stock broker. Some boomers have stock they have owned for many years with a large capital gain. If they sell the stock, they have to pay tax on the capital gain. If they donate the stock to a recognized 501 (c) (3) organization, no tax liability exists. Transferring stock from the donor's account to the museum account is very simple.

The donor can take a tax deduction on the value of the stock on the day it is tranferred.

So make it easy and profitable to donate.
Author:  Rick Rowlands [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 1:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
Do we underestimate the effect that radical environmentalism is having on coal fired steam power? The environmentalists are constantly beating the drums about how polluting and dangerous coal power plants are, and at some point the public is going to equate that with coal burning locomotives. It won't be seen as cool, sexy, or politically correct to like our dirty, polluting, CO2 spewing, global warming causing, polar bear killing, glacier melting steam locomotives. Guess what is being heavily pushed in public schools these days? Environmentism!

Secondly, steam isn't operated as much as in the past for the very same reasons that the industry rid themselves of steam. Its a business decision. When you basically have to tear the thing down to the frames every so many years and rebuild it, at a six figure cost, that presents a huge barrier to continued operation. If the railroad is just sliding by year to year, how are they going to be able to fund the locomotive rebuild? Its very easy to park the steamer and run the diesel, which requires no complete teardown to continue in operation.
Author:  p51 [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
wilkinsd wrote:
Finally an observation and it is not generational. Given the pervasiveness of the internet these days, I see a lot of examples where people (of all ages) confuse online action with actual, real-life action. Just pushing the "like" button, or watching a YouTube video does not replace a flue or help establish your museum's endowment. This problem, called "slacktivism" has been around for ages, but the growth of the internet makes it easier to partake in. While it is important to appeal to and market to the internet culture, how you can turn slacktivism into real, honest, hardworking volunteer hours is beyond me.

AMEN. It drives me nuts to see all these online petitions being bandied about on forums like this, as if they produce any real results at all.
Author:  Alan Walker [ Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: The Baby Boomer Effect
p51 wrote:
wilkinsd wrote:
Finally an observation and it is not generational. Given the pervasiveness of the internet these days, I see a lot of examples where people (of all ages) confuse online action with actual, real-life action. Just pushing the "like" button, or watching a YouTube video does not replace a flue or help establish your museum's endowment. This problem, called "slacktivism" has been around for ages, but the growth of the internet makes it easier to partake in. While it is important to appeal to and market to the internet culture, how you can turn slacktivism into real, honest, hardworking volunteer hours is beyond me.

AMEN. It drives me nuts to see all these online petitions being bandied about on forums like this, as if they produce any real results at all.


Indeed. If I have something to say to my elected representatives, I call their office or write/e-mail them directly. If I really feel strongly about a matter, I will pay a visit in person. Though around here, that might get you an escort out by security if the staff think you'll ask questions that they might seriously have to answer.
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