The owner of the defunct Minnesota Zephyr dinner train in Stillwater, MN says in an article in the St. Paul Pioneer Press he intends to scrap the two F7s that pulled the train. The train is landlocked and the units would have to be trucked out. The City of Stillwater wants them out, and the owner has had several months to move them but hasn't because of the high cost.

The owner, Dave Paradeau, says he doesn't want to scrap them since they are still operational - although no doubt far from FRA acceptable. I beleive one unit is ex-BN, the other ex-C&NW.

If any museums out there are interested, this might be an opportunity, but time is of the essence.

A link to the article is here:

http://www.twincities.com/localnews/ci_ ... e-off-city

Outrageous the situation those F-units are in. Hope they are spared somehow at the eleventh hour.

This seems like a replay of scrapping that RI car in Iowa. Would scrapping these F-units yield a larger return than selling them for some other purpose? I realize that all of the non-scapping sales options are fraught with variables and take time. But, I am just wondering in general terms.

What would an F7 return to the owner if he called in a scapper to tear it up and haul it away?

Steve -

Any idea as to the heritage of the BN unit? SP&S? GN? NP? CB&Q? Or......?


Les

Minnesota Zephyr 787 was originally SP&S 804, then BN 9756.
Minnesota Zephyr 788 was originally C&NW 4082A.

http://donsdepot.donrossgroup.net/dr880.htm

Scot

After the dinner train shut down the equipment got listed at well over $500,000. I suspect that based on the condition of the equipment and what it will take to make it interchangable (much less Amtrak certified) that no one went beyond the tire kicking stage before deciding not to buy. If the price is drastically reduced there is still the chance to save this stuff but after reading back through the threads on RYPN and the local press it doesn't sound like he will do that.

"On July 27, a main suspension beam on a 16-axle trailer snapped while crews were moving one locomotive, Paradeau said. Train movers left the locomotive right where it was -- on property owned by the city of Stillwater, he said. "


So... he got a rate to move the engines and the movers screwed up -

Didn't they have insurance? Why couldn't the train have still been moved as
promised? Either by the same company with their repaired /replaced equipment or another company with the refund he should've gotten?

Reminds me of a certain bridge in NY. Amtrak paid for a red bridge and got a faded pink bridge (within a year or so). Anyone else have a problem with that?

The city could've gotten a good deal on those engines - 'shame they have little interest in history. I'm sure a Walmart would have more appeal to the city to help give them a little character.

He should advertise them for scrap value to an interested party, at the very least.

/Mitch

Darn it!! Anytime an F unit is to be scrapped is a loss to all of us!!! Surely some method can be found to rescue these two survivors of the 1940's. They deserve a better fate than to be cut up for scrap!!!!!!

Seems to me that the pricing scheme on F-units (and some other subtypes) has become grossly distorted. I wonder if those who set these prices haven't been influenced by what they observe within the collector auto marketplace.

These days, the upper echelons of the used locomotive market are populated by EMD 4 motor locos such as GP-38 and GP40 models. In good running condition. these can sell for prices in excess of what they cost new (approx $200K). These prices are driven by: a) multiplicity of applications, b) lack of new, affordable equivalents in the new loco market, c) suitability for cost-effective upgrades and d)other. Modern EMD switchers (SW1500, MP15) also can be subject to these criteria.

At the same time, SD40/40-2's sell at a fraction of what they cost new-based upon oversupply and a leeser number of applications vs. the EMD 4-motor described previously.

At the lower end of the marketplace sit such locos as Alco's, BLW's and F-units.
There are a limited number of applications for these-based upon a small number of end-users...and the unsuitability of carbody type units for freight work.

With that said, F-unit pricing is (IMHO) way out of sync with reality. Pricing should be buyer-driven...not seller driven.

DPK

What price are you referring to? Has the owner of the two F7s from the dinner train quoted a selling price?

See my post above. The entire train is over $500,000 where is, as is. I inquired last year before he moved the stuff and was told $125K for the 2 F units plus I would be responsible for moving them.

SO,

Okay, I understand. So the pricing for the locomotives was quoted to you at $125,000 for both of them. Does anyone have a guess as to what price for each locomotive would be appropriate to expect to sell within 30 days?

Does anybody have an estimate of what each locomotive would return from scrapping?

The current asking price is $55K each, which is about scrap value. That does not include transportation to your museum, railroad, etc. Why should the current owner take a loss so you can afford transportation costs? Do you have a plan for the locomotives once you acquire them? Or were you kicking tires? You know, don't you, that first coist is usually only a small part of final cost.

Mike

For what it is worth, here are links to the locomotives on ozarkmountain's website. Looks like the asking price was $55k each back in April 2011.

http://www.ozarkmountainrailcar.com/det ... MD-F7A-787

http://www.ozarkmountainrailcar.com/det ... MD-F7A-788

Mike,

I am not sure who you are talking to, but nobody has suggested that the owner should take a loss so a buyer can afford transportations costs. I can't speak for the others, but yes I do know that the first cost is only part of the final cost.

My interest is in learning if there is any market solution to the problem of the locomotives besides scrapping them. If the seller can net $55,000 (as you say) for each locomotive by calling a scrapper, then I don't see any hope for the locomotives to escape scrapping.