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Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=37339		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  M Austin [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 8:38 am ]
Post subject:  Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen Link

"Her boiler was lifted from her frames and dispatched to DB Meiningen Locomotive Works, Germany, where it was built, for overhaul."
"The main item of work during Tornado's intermediate overhaul will be a full internal inspection of her boiler, requiring the removal of all of the tubes, as the boiler first steamed in January 2008. As a precaution the firebox foundation ring corners will be renewed and a significant number of stays replaced. The boiler and smokebox have been sent to DB Meiningen to carry out this work in order complete it in the shortest possible time. The boiler is expected back from DB Meiningen at the end of January 2015."
A1Steam.com
Author:  Frisco1522 [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 12:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
Seems like they are having quite a few boiler issues with that engine.
Author:  Dave [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 12:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
This could be a planned incremental overhaul, not a response to problems, much like our 15 year requirement. 80K is a lot of hard fast steaming miles. Have any of our mainline excursions produced 80K revenue miles in 7 years as a comparison?

dave
Author:  M Austin [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 12:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
UP 844 has close to 90K miles last time I inquired. 70K before its 15K romp.
Author:  robertjohndavis [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 12:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
I don't know enough about her amount/type of operation to compare her boiler needs to other similar-sized British locomotives in main line service to speculate upon whether this work is to be expected or not.

What does strike me is that they have the wherewithal to lift the boiler, ship it away and have it come back repaired and ready to be refit on the frames in less than 3 months time. I'd take that as a sign of a group that has its act together.

It is interesting to follow the needs of British mainline steam locomotives. Outside of the Colorado narrow gauge, I don't think there are any steam locomotives in our hempishere that come close to either the amount of work or the demands of work that the top UK mainline steamers see each year. While most of them do venture out onto low speed heritage routes, they are maintained for the big stage. Imagine if we had a small fleet of PRR K4 and G5 locos that ran multiple trips a week on the Acela route and you start to get a picture of the UK scene.

Rob
Author:  robertjohndavis [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 12:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
M Austin wrote:
UP 844 has close to 90K miles last time I inquired. 70K before its 15K romp.


That's an interesting comparison given #844 also has boiler needs, but her owners don't have a 3 month solution. Is the 90K mile figure since her last 1472 day inspection? I'd still bet Tornado has worked harder and with less diesel assist than our favorite FEF over the past 7 years.

Rob
Author:  sleepermonster [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 12:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
The basic UK boiler regime is that boilers should be stripped and internally examined every ten years, but every seven years for locomotives operating on the national main lines.

Occasionally you will see "mainline engines" working out the last few years of their boiler tickets on private heritage lines, but not many can use Tornado in regular service.

The seven years will be up in January, so this is routine, and anything that might give trouble in the next seven years will no doubt be done at the same time.

Tim
Author:  googanelli [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 1:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
I'd love to see someone contract to have them build an american boiler that we could scratch build. For the results and timeliness of their work, it certainly could be interesting.

Joe
Author:  Dave [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 1:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
There are technological differences - it isn't unusual for a boiler to be removed in the UK but it is unusual in the US. Many British locomotives ended their working life with boilers from others in the same class as they were traded off to get overhauls out on the road efficiently. Everything is physically smaller over there also.

I don't know if anybody has approached Meiningen with a proposal to build a US style boiler according to historic US practices. It might be interesting, but probably nothing that we couldn't do in the US or Canada with less regulatory translation hassles, and less costly shipping. If anybody wants to try it would be good to hear about it.

dave
Author:  M Austin [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 2:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
robertjohndavis wrote:
Outside of the Colorado narrow gauge, I don't think there are any steam locomotives in our hempishere that come close to either the amount of work or the demands of work that the top UK mainline steamers see each year.


Considering the average European boiler is about the size of a K-36's.....(what are the specs on Tornado's boiler?)
Boiler Comparison Link
Author:  whodom [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 2:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
On a related topic, this thread reminded me of the fiasco with the new boiler Meiningen built for 4-6-2 #3801 in Australia.. There seems to be absolutely no news on that since ~2011 when Meiningen supposedly agreed to take the boiler back and fix the defects.

Has anyone heard anything else?
Author:  M Austin [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 2:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
German thread showing 3801 boiler work progression photos from Jan 2012-Nov 2012 Link

Image


Image
Author:  Lincoln Penn [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 3:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
robertjohndavis wrote:
M Austin wrote:
UP 844 has close to 90K miles last time I inquired. 70K before its 15K romp.


That's an interesting comparison given #844 also has boiler needs, but her owners don't have a 3 month solution. Is the 90K mile figure since her last 1472 day inspection? I'd still bet Tornado has worked harder and with less diesel assist than our favorite FEF over the past 7 years.

Rob


If you are referring to that FEF-3 and how it's been run since 2011, I would certanly agree. There were times in the period 2011-2013 when that engine had diesel assist when it was only pulling 4 or 5 cars across the Nebraska prairies.

BEFORE 2011, it was a completely different story.
Author:  sleepermonster [ Thu Nov 20, 2014 1:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
The Tornado boiler weighed 21 long tons when fitted, which may have been without tubes. The weight of the whole engine is given as just over 105 tons.

On a lot of UK engines there is no option but to remove the boiler for overhaul as the bottom of the firebox is tucked between the plate frames on most designs. There is no other way to examine the outside of the firebox and foundation ring fully.

Being in a small and tightly packed country can have its advantages, I recently had to hire an 80 ton crane to put the frames back on the wheels of an 0-6-0; £600 for half a day. I get the impression that transport and cranage charges are far higher in the USA.

Tim
Author:  whodom [ Thu Nov 20, 2014 2:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tornado Boiler Back to Meiningen
Matt- thanks for the link to the 3801 thread. It appears it's taking longer to fix 3801's boiler than it took to build it in the first place. Considering the problems that were found, I guess that shouldn't be surprising.
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