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| Plain Bearing Babbitt https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=39506 |
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| Author: | mldeets [ Thu Jun 16, 2016 8:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Plain Bearing Babbitt |
If you were to re-pour babbitt in a plain bearing brass, what type/make/supplier/brand/manufacturer would you use? Thanks....mld (Edited to dispel propaganda & re-spell correctly) |
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| Author: | Harry Nicholls [ Thu Jun 16, 2016 9:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Friction Bearing Babbit |
While I was employed by a railroad contractor, I was able to get used, worn out brasses from cars we cut up. By using my torch, I was able to recover the Babbitt and cast it into small bricks. I did have it tested to see what the metal contained and it was fine to be remelted and re-poured on brasses. By doing this, I was able to supply Babbitt to Orange Empire Museum for use on a set of trucks needing Babbited brasses. I did check with a large Babbitt company in west Texas about their scrap Babbitt, which they did not remelt or reuse, and found then that new Babbitt was running over $10.00 per pound in large quantities and much higher for small quantities. Now, these used brasses are not available to me as they were way back in 1990 and brass prices has dropped in the last few years. but, this is a nice way to recover Babbitt and still have the brass for reuse or sale for scrap. If you can find any old railroad brasses, you might try this recovery process. |
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| Author: | David Johnston [ Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Friction Bearing Babbit |
I have used Rotometals, 800-779-1102, for soft metal alloys. If you order 400 pounds, they will make it up to your specification. They also carry babbitting supplies. ASTM B23, grade 13 looks a lot like the AAR specified material. It is available from Rotometals. If you are going to have the Babbitt commercially poured, you need to find out how the contractor feels about pouring lead based babbitt. If you are going to pour it yourself, you need to learn how to tin the brass before you pour the Babbitt. You will need babbitting putty, lots of wet rags, safety equipment to protect personal against hot metal splashes, and a way to check the temperature of the Babbitt before you pour. |
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| Author: | Kelly Anderson [ Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Friction Bearing Babbit |
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| Author: | Overmod [ Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Friction Bearing Babbit |
The part of Magnolia's site that gives product information, including the section for "Babbitts", is apparently down (at least for me). Composition of the babbitts can be obtained by going to 'Downloads', then safety data sheets for the tin and lead babbitts respectively. Specs for alloy CDA 93600 are here: http://alloys.copper.org/alloy/C93600?referrer=facetedsearch (Thanks go to the OP for putting the second 't' in the name of the alloy! It was a bit like a sharp stick in the eye woth only one... ;-} ) And I agree with Mr. Anderson's point about calling them 'plain' and not 'friction' bearings. Stamp out propaganda and euphemisms where you can! |
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| Author: | Rick Rowlands [ Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Friction Bearing Babbit |
I have about a half ton of new ingot SAE 14 / ASTM 7 lead babbitt. If it would be of any use to anyone, please contact me via PM. Its for sale. |
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| Author: | Kelly Anderson [ Fri Jun 17, 2016 12:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Friction Bearing Babbit |
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| Author: | mldeets [ Fri Jun 17, 2016 2:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Plain Bearing Babbitt |
One must first be aware of propaganda before they can help dispel it. Until I read Mr. Anderson's post I had no idea the term would "rub some the wrong way" (pun intended). Correction has taken place. As to the spelling error, I apologize for hurrying and will note that the single "t" spelling did not trigger a spell - check flag. Admittedly a poor excuse. I do appreciate all the useful information posted so far and look forward to future posts. RYPN at its' best - you never know what you'll learn from who or where. mld |
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| Author: | mldeets [ Fri Jun 17, 2016 3:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Plain Bearing Babbitt |
Helping to answer my own question I finally found this thread: http://rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=28798 and am wondering how much suppliers have changes since then. mld |
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| Author: | Nova55 [ Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Plain Bearing Babbitt |
We use Babbitt from Belmont Metals, Brooklyn NY. |
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| Author: | Adam Phillips [ Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Plain Bearing Babbitt |
Here is the old standard. When drafting this post, all the formatting looked right but after posting, it squishes everything to the left. For the two sets of chemical properties (A/B and C/D) I have inserted slashes so you can distinguish the values in column A from B and C from D. AMERICAN RAILWAY ASSOCIATION MECHANICAL DIVISION Master Car Builders Master Mechanics SPECIFICATIONS ________ BEARINGS, JOURNALS, LINED Recommended Practice ADOPTED, 1915; REVISED, 1920. __________ 1. Scope. – These specifications cover journal bearings for use on locomotive tenders, passenger train cars and freight train cars. 2. Manufacture.—Before lining, the brass backs shall be bored and thoroughly tinned in accordance with the best standard practice. The thick- ness of linings which is desired shall be specified in the order. If it is not specified, linings one-quarter inch thick shall be furnished. After lining, the ends of the bearings shall be made smooth by scraping, filing or machining. They must not be ground or rubbed with abrasive materials. I. CHEMICAL PROPERTIES AND TESTS. 3. Composition of Back.-- PER CENT. A / B Lead . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 16 to 24 / 24 to 30 Tin . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 to 7 / 4 (Min.) Total of other impurities, maximum. . . . . . . . 4 / 3 Copper . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 67 to 77 / 63 to 72 Within the ranges permitted, the tin and lead should vary, if at all, in opposite directions, the tin being increased for the lower percentages of lead. The owner of the equipment on which the bearings are to be used shall specify which class of metal is desired. If he does not do so, metal of Class A shall be furnished. 4. Composition of Lining. – C / D Tin . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 to 5 / 0.5 to 1.5 Antimony . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 8 to 10 / . . . . . . . . Antimony plus tin . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 12 to 14 / 3 to 5 Arsenic, maximum . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.2 / 0.5 Lead . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 85 to 88 / 94 to 96 Metal of Class C is for linings of a nominal thickness over 1/8 in. Metal of Class D is for linings of 1/8 in. or less in nominal thicknesses. This classification is independent of the composition of the back. Either composition of the back may be used with the composition of lining metal specified for the thickness of lining which is ordered. 5. Analysis— The sample for chemical analysis of the shell shall consist of a thorough mixture of equal quantities of fine drillings taken at three points on the bearing, surface metal being discarded. The sample for analysis of the lining shall be taken by scraping the lining, after removing surface metal. II. PHYSICAL PROPERTIES AND TESTS. 6. Tests.—The finished casting representing a lot for acceptance shall be broken, either longitudinally or transversely, or both, in order to ascertain the uniformity of the grain of the metal. When this fracture shows separation or imperfect mixing of component parts or dross or dirt spots, the lot shall be rejected. 7. Number of Tests.—Bearings shall be divided into lots of 300 or less, and one bearing shall be taken for test and chemical analysis from each lot. III. PERMISSABLE VARIATIONS. 8. Gaging.—All bearings shall conform to the latest standards of the Mechanical Section of the American Railroad Association, with respect to form and dimensions and variations therefrom. IV. FINISH 9. Finish.—All bearing surfaces shall be smooth and free from tool marks. The castings shall be sound and free from blow-holes, dross, and mechanical defects. V. MARKING 10. Marking.—Each lot of 300 or less shall bear a serial number, commencing with 1 at the beginning of the year and continuing consecutively until the end of the year, at each manufacturer’s plant. The bearings shall be cast with marks as shown in Fig. I. |
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