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| Pikes Peak Cog Railway https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=42137 |
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| Author: | Edd Fuller [ Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
The Pikes Peak Cog Railway did not open this season, and after 126 years of operation, its future is uncertain. Jason Stamper was in Colorado last summer to enjoy this beautiful ride which may very well become a thing of the past. http://thetracksidephotographer.com/201 ... ikes-peak/ Thanks, Edd Fuller |
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| Author: | WVNorthern [ Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
The city of Manitou Springs made tax concessions that the Cog Railway had requested, so presumably they are planning on rebuilding the track and acquiring new cars. |
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| Author: | Bobharbison [ Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
WVNorthern wrote: The city of Manitou Springs made tax concessions that the Cog Railway had requested, so presumably they are planning on rebuilding the track and acquiring new cars. Well, they give tax cuts to places like Google, Amazon, Boeing and Sports franchises, so I'm not surprised that this one passed as well. Seems like a worthy cause. |
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| Author: | Jason Midyette [ Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
I guess now we see the motivation of the M&PP suddenly wearing itself out during the off season...... Hard to believe that a tourist RR that is at capacity for its entire season, survived the great depression and has always maintained its equipment and track in top notch condition now can't survive without tax subsidies. Of course it has not always been owned by a big company (Xanterra) that is well connected with government at all levels. For over a century the M&PP supported itself and added to the economy of Manitou Springs. Now it seems that the most moneyed owner that the RR has ever had feels that Manitou Springs (and probably El Paso County and Colorado as a whole) owes him in order to continue to bennefit from the railroad. Sorry for the politics but I don't see how you separate it out from this one. Remember, government id not the friend of preservation or tourist railroads, unless of course they are owned by a well connected billionaire.... Jason Midyette |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
Jason Midyette wrote: Hard to believe that a tourist RR that is at capacity for its entire season, survived the great depression and has always maintained its equipment and track in top notch condition I have no proverbial "dog in this fight," but this assertion sharply contrasts with assertions of "worn out track/racks" that were made in the previous thread on this topic, and it seemed to me that the alleged "deferred maintenance" predated the current owner's acquisition. And deferred maintenance and inadequate infrastructure investment is hardly unique to big business; in fact, it's seemingly more common with local governments that often defer replacing things like bridges and water mains until a crisis occurs. I will, however, agree with the idea that the idea of granting tax breaks--or even instituting government investment or programs--based on suggested (and increasingly inflated) "multiplier effects" of the business on the local economy is, to my eye at least, a scam that should have been nipped in the bud ages ago. Unfortunately, it's become part of the "status quo" now. |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Thu Jun 28, 2018 2:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
In the News: Quote: Tuesday night, the council voted in favor of an ordinance that gives the new owners tax breaks while they invest $100 million to rebuild the railway up to to the top of Pikes Peak. http://www.kktv.com/content/news/Manito ... 39881.html Imagine another tourist railroad of any sort having $100 million to invest in their line. |
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| Author: | Zak Lybrand [ Thu Jun 28, 2018 2:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
Now let's clear one thing up about the ownership: the Manitou & Pikes Peak Cog Railway is NOT owned by Xanterra Parks & Resorts; rather, it is owned by the Broadmoor Hotel, who is owned by the Oklahoma Publishing Company which is a business that Phil Anschutz bought in 2011. While Phil Anschutz DOES have control over both Xanterra and the Broadmoor, they're not the same entities. This might explain why perhaps there wasn't much more involvement from Grand Canyon Railway management in any way, shape, or form. Hell, I was surprised when I heard that Eric Hadder had gone out to M&PP to help them learn how to operate their steam locomotive. |
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| Author: | Ed Kapuscinski [ Thu Jun 28, 2018 3:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
All it takes is some tax breaks! |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Thu Jun 28, 2018 4:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
Correction made to my post above. Thanks for the correction of detail. |
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| Author: | whodom [ Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
IIRC, Swiss steam locomotive builder DLM (successor to SLM) payed a sales visit to Pikes Peak some years ago. It sure would be neat to see a couple of the new-design rack steamers in service on Pikes Peak.  Light oil firing, all roller bearings, something like 10% overall efficiency (much better than traditional steam), one man operation, and the fire can be shut off for the downhill trip. I'm sure the appearance could be "Americanized" if desired. |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Thu Nov 29, 2018 4:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
Good news: The line will survive after all. Bad News: Quote: As part of the reconstruction, the existing track would be demolished and rebuilt and the depot will be remodeled. Four of the eight cars will be taken out of service and replaced by three new cars that seat up to 240 people. The other four cars will be refurbished. Debatable: the financial methods for funding the renovation/replacement: Quote: Earlier this month, the city council approved a revised deal to set the stage for a 50-year pact. According to The Gazette, during the first 25 years, Manitou Springs will cap excise tax revenue that it collects on ticket sales. The limit will increase incrementally, from $507,500 to $775,000 in the last three years. In the last 25 years, rebates will be limited so the cog would not pay less than a 3.8 percent city excise tax on ticket sales. The cog also must pay the city $1.25 million by the end of 202 [sic] to make up for lost tax revenue from the railway’s closure. The correction: The line is owned by Oklahoma Publishing(?!?!?), not Xanterra as alleged upthread. https://kdvr.com/2018/11/29/pikes-peak- ... struction/ |
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| Author: | diningcartim [ Thu Nov 29, 2018 4:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote: The correction: The line is owned by Oklahoma Publishing(?!?!?), not Xanterra as alleged upthread. https://kdvr.com/2018/11/29/pikes-peak- ... struction/ Oklahoma Publishing was the entity that bought the Broadmoor Hotel and related properties (which include the Cog Railway) from the El Pomar Foundation in 1988 (El Pomar was set up by the builder of the Broadmoor, Sencer Penrose) due to changes in tax laws that made its ownership problematic. The Anschutz Corporation bought the Oklahoma Publishing Company in 2011. So yes, they are in a different "silo" than Xanterra, but when you go to the Broadmoors website it has a link to "Affiliates" which has most of the Xanterra properties listed. |
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| Author: | TrainDetainer [ Thu Nov 29, 2018 5:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
Quote: The cog also must pay the city $1.25 million by the end of 202 [sic] to make up for lost tax revenue from the railway’s closure. So in Colorado you have to pay tax on tickets you didn't sell? Would seem like a real dealbreaker to me. Oklahoma Publishing must really be betting they'll still have a genuine cash cow after the long closing/rebuild/reopening. |
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| Author: | EJ Berry [ Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
Today's (1-23-2019) International Railway Journal reports the M&PP has ordered three locomotives and nine railcars from Stadler Rail. Phil Mulligan |
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| Author: | Brian Norden [ Thu Jan 24, 2019 1:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pikes Peak Cog Railway |
I found this press release online: media release from 1/21/2019 mentioning Pikes Peak order (and other orders) First Stadler US FLIRT trains go into service in Texas and more milestones in the U.S. Also here is the webpage for Stadler's USA facility: Stadler US Inc., Salt Lake City, USA, USA |
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