I found this image on ebay:
What was the story behind the Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole? Did it ever actually operate? What happened to the car #97 pictured?
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| Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=43228 |
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| Author: | diningcartim [ Sat Apr 06, 2019 11:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole |
I found this image on ebay: What was the story behind the Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole? Did it ever actually operate? What happened to the car #97 pictured? |
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| Author: | Bowmore [ Sat Apr 06, 2019 11:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole |
Apparently not.- I googled the railroad and came up with an archive of documents pertaining to this railroad. There were plans made to run on the abandoned L:IRR line, but it looks like it never happened. |
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| Author: | robertjohndavis [ Sat Apr 06, 2019 12:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole |
Sure looks like CNJ #97 on the turntable at Mauch Chunk. |
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| Author: | bedt14 [ Sat Apr 06, 2019 2:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole |
IIRC, Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole was a venture between Ron Ziel and George Foster. BEDT #12 and #16 [Porter 0-6-0T] were purchased (12 by Ziel, 16 by Foster] for intended use on the SH&SH 12 was moved from Brooklyn, NY to PRR Meadows Yard, and 16 never got moved and stayed in Brooklyn, albeit abandoned until 1993. |
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| Author: | co614 [ Sat Apr 06, 2019 4:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole |
I believe the photo shows Ron Ziel's PV on the turntable at Jim Thorpe in 1966. We used it as the tail car on our first HICO steam excursions from Jersey City,NJ to Jim Thorpe over the CRRofNJ in October 1966. Ron's plan was to institute steam powered tourist service on an abandoned LIRR line on Long Island. For a variety of reasons it never got done. Great memories, Ross Rowland |
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| Author: | Bowmore [ Sat Apr 06, 2019 6:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole |
I just spoke to someone at the Long Island Rail Museum . My main reason was to get info on their 25 ton GE. I did bring up the SH & SH, and the man laughed, and said it was doomed before it started. He did not elaborate. |
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| Author: | Richard Glueck [ Sat Apr 06, 2019 7:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole |
Ron and George were going to replace track on the abandoned Sag Harbor branch of the LIRR. As mentioned above, the power was to be two ex-BEDT locos, #12 and #16. The CNJ observation car was painted up in blue and white for a promotional run behind Steamtown #127 (nee CPR 1278), with Ross as the promoter. Ross's tour on the CNJ went fine, but the Sag Harbor and Scuttle Hole (named for Scuttle Hole Road, on eastern LI) did not get traction. Some of this had to do with vision of what could be, and not conveying it well. Some of it had to do with Ron's personality, which could be "abrasive" and myopic. He was a great photographer and author and friend, but his vision of how things should be tended to be hardened and unyielding. Ron and George purchased a PRR parlor car which I remember as "Poplar Heights", had it painted as SH & SH "Sunrise County". It was left on a siding where vandals got into it and destroyed the whole thing, stripping it of furnishings and wrecking everything else. It was scrapped. A privately owned wooden NYC caboose was painted up as well, but fortunately, only stood in Jamaica station before leaving the Island. A fan trip to show the viability of steam on Long Island was undersold and lost the investment. There was long term goal to get PRR E6s #460 refurbished and running on the rails, which would have been entirely implausible, as the whole proposed railroad might have been 5 miles in length. Obviously, that never got anywhere. The Sag Harbor and Scuttle Hole Railroad was a nice idea, but should have been teased out significantly more before it was proposed as viable. |
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| Author: | philip.marshall [ Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sag Harbor & Scuttle Hole |
Some background on the LIRR Sag Harbor Branch: http://www.trainsarefun.com/lirr/sag%20harbor%20branch/sag%20harbor%20branch.htm It was abandoned and rails lifted between Bridgehampton and Sag Harbor in 1939, so to propose returning the line to service almost 30 years later was an unlikely dream at best. -Philip Marshall |
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