I was pursuing through this month's Lancaster NHRS chapter newsletter and noticed an article regarding the PRR keystone station signs along the original mainline (Phila-Paoli). The article is on the 5th page

Recently, SEPTA and the Radnor historical society installed replicas of the PRR St. Davids station sign on the inbound and outbound station platforms. SEPTA has expressed interest in installing replicas of the PRR station signs on the mainline.

In order to do so, they will require the original signs (or even replicas of the original signs) to use as a mold for the castings. If you, or someone you know, has one of the signs from this part of the PRR system, they are asking to contact one of the members of the Historical Society. His contact information is in the newsletter which is linked below.

http://www.nrhs1.org/assets/2103_MAR_Dispatcher.pdf

Don’t know if this will help, but there is a large cache of PRR standard plans on Rob Schoenberg’s Pennsy Pages: http://prr.railfan.net/standards/

The keystone station sign widths varied by the length of the station name so a one size fits all may not work. 1928 standard plan: http://prr.railfan.net/standards/standards.cgi?plan=78160-A

The lettering that goes with it: http://prr.railfan.net/standards/standards.cgi?plan=78000-C

Contact Rob about commercial use.

Some years ago, when I was still working for MARC, I was able to obtain a pair of reproduction PRR station signs for our Odenton station from a hobby/souvenir outfit. I don't believe I have seen them advertising for some time, though. Last time I was by Odenton, they were still there.

I did wonder if they were originals or not.....

As photographed in October 2016.

If you need to look at an original PRR sign the RR Museum of PA has at least one. I saved the Aspinwall (PA) sign when the station was torn down in 1965. After lugging it thru several moves (120 lbs of cast iron) I donated it to RRMPA in the 1980s. PRR had repainted the entire station not long before all service there ended in Nov. 1964, so the paint on the sign was very fresh when I got it. To remove any doubts, it was obtained thru PRR officials and removed from its lofty perch by the B&B crew dismantling the station. I have heard of others "collecting" these signs by "other methods."

Thank you all for the responses. In this situation, I am merely the messenger and am not involved in the project. I'd love to see this come to fruition, so relayed the request here to help reach a broader audience.

From what I've read, they are trying to source the original signs to make the molds. I'm sure they have considered re-fabricating from scratch, although this would probably be more time/labor/cost intensive.

Perhaps they should consider 3-D printing? Likely far easier and cheaper.

/s/ Larry

I've run the original query past the PRRT&HS via their e-mail group.

This is one of those cases where details are sort of an "open secret" among the "right" people. I've been told the locations of all four original PRR signs for Lewistown (Lewistown Junction) were known among the PRRT&HS even before they acquired the station for their archives/museum. And I'm certain I saw examples of a couple of the desired signs sell for high prices at auctions in southeastern Pa. in the 1980s and 1990s.

I've had the privilege of standing before a huge two-story interior wall somewhere in Pennsylvania covered with PRR station signs and locomotive number/builder's plates, and I'm betting one or two others have shared that experience as well.

As I'm sure most folks realize cast metal shrinks as it cools.

Cast Iron (depending on the flavor; gray, soft, malleable, etc.) shrinks about 1-2 % when it cools.

So, a 1 foot long sign reproduced from a mold taken directly from an existing sign would be 1/8 to 1/4 inch too short.

If possible the best approach would be a 3D scan of an original sign scaled up by 1-2 % in a cad program to make a 3D printed pattern for a sand mold.

I am not aware of anyone doing 3D printing of cast iron. Some high tech aerospace folks are doing 3D printing of titanium, but it takes lots of dollars to access that capability,

In the old days the PRR pattern makers would use a "shrink ruler" (a special ruler that was already scaled to account for the shrinkage) to make a mold that would result in the final casting being the dimensions specified on the drawing. Shrink rulers are a "hot" collectable in the "old machine tool" market;

https://www.ebay.com/itm/253842517539?c ... ntid=51291

Cheers, Kevin.

I'm 99.5% certain that the ONLY people that care enough that these replicas are precisely the correct size are what Jim Boyd called "SPFs"--"Slobbering Pennsy Foamers!"

You are probably correct in your assessment, I was just trying to illustrate how modern techniques would allow the production of an accurate replica.

Anyway since someone is "hoarding" all the originals and seems unlikely to come forward to allow them to be "digitized" what difference does it make....

Cheers, Kevin (not a SPF)

So why do replicas need to be made of cast iron?


Or, more easily, you just create a 3-D file in AutoCAD (using those PRR standard plans as your guide) and use that file to print a replica in something other than cast iron. Far easier than locating the original (if it even still exists) and then lugging around several hundred pounds of cast iron. Plus, you know perfectly well somebody will *appropriate* the replica for *safekeeping* in the security of his private collection, so you might as well make it something easy and inexpensive to reproduce after the inevitable theft.

I never saw the PRR signs at Villanova Station. Without a doubt, they had disappeared into fraternity houses long before I matriculated there.

/s/ Larry

So why do replicas need to be made of cast iron?

The only reason to make them cast iron would be to make them a bit more difficult to "preserve", honestly, if someone wanted to make patterns, I'd think casting them out of aluminum would be far more efficient.

If some would do this and offer them at a reasonable price, I think they would sell. I'm not a SPF, but I'd like a nice replica Keystone out of material that is obviously not the real thing, and marked on the back with replica and a date.

Ken Miller

I remember being told that there had been some "issues" with replicas made from resin or other non-metallic substances weathering for years or decades outside. I've seen a couple well-done (and, to be fair, not-so-well-done) replica station signs done in wood or other materials that badly deteriorated from exposure and neglect. In at least one case, it was plain the plywood was de-laminating.

I know they don't make locomotive nameplate replacements out of plastic-like materials for actual locos both out of a sense of pride ("we did it right!") and because it won't stand up to the locomotive's vibrations otherwise.

Cast iron is heavy enough, but I was responsible for providing the metal for one replica/replacement that we made in former Linotype type metal, an alloy of lead, tin, zinc and antimony with a low melt point. The joke I made with that one was "if they try to steal it, they'll be crushed to death under it!!" Last I knew it was still in place; I'm sworn to secrecy lest some fisherman steal it for sinker casting........

The one on the station in Tyrone, PA, in 2010, was just a suitably cut to shape piece of sheet metal that had been handpainted accordingly....