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Sierra Railroad NARCOA (time to open up a new can of worms)
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Author:  RCD [ Thu Jul 29, 2021 10:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Sierra Railroad NARCOA (time to open up a new can of worms)
So apparently there was a railroad crossing accident during a NARCOA operation on Sierra Railroad. So anyone have the low down on what happened and the aftermath?
Author:  cjvrr [ Fri Jul 30, 2021 9:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Sierra Railroad NARCOA (time to open up a new can of wor
It was many years ago. An operator went through a crossing and got hit by a road vehicle.

There was a lawsuit and the speeder group was not found at fault.

I have no information beyond that.
Author:  jayrod [ Fri Jul 30, 2021 7:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sierra Railroad NARCOA (time to open up a new can of wor
Interesting. To my knowledge, there have been no recent NARCOA sanctioned events on any Sierra properties. Doesn’t mean something didn’t happen somewhere but I find no evidence of a NARCOA accident on Sierra.
Author:  Pegasuspinto [ Sat Jul 31, 2021 9:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Sierra Railroad NARCOA (time to open up a new can of wor
Best I can tell, there is a huge rift as ugly as any you have ever seen, between NARCOA and "the others" over insulated wheels vs shunted wheels, which I suspect goes back to this accident and maybe other incidents. NARCOA wants the wheels insulated and crossings flagged, while other groups want to shunt and activate signals and crossings. Friendships have been ruined, members expelled, nasty arguments, etc. Proof that we can find something to fight over no matter what your hobby is.
Author:  robertmacdowell [ Sat Aug 07, 2021 9:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sierra Railroad NARCOA (time to open up a new can of wor
I spent a lot of time in railway preservation and around MoW crews. Almost all mechanized MoW equipment such as tampers, tie inserters and the like are insulated. You don't *want* them trying to shunt, for several reasons.

First, the shunting is not reliable. MoW equipment doesn't put enough weight on the rail to get reliable contact, which means the crossing flashers either don't work and you're charging up on an unprotected crossing possibly unawares... or stutter which confuses drivers... or cuts out on you unexpectedly which means traffic is suddenly releasing and starting to cross just as you enter the intersection. It's just not workable.

Second, certainly in an MoW context, you're *often* working inside an approach circuit, so your movements would be either holding the crossing protection on, or making it cut in and out as you work. All that is bad, because awkward, complicated or unreliable security which operates at the expense of usability is actually at the expense of security. If it doesn't apparently *work*, people will quickly defeat the safety protections: e.g. presume all flashers are false positives and ignore them.

Third, every railroad rulebook I have ever seen calls for ALL speeders and MoW equipment to either stop and let traffic clear before crossing, because it can't hit you when you're behind it. Or if traffic is too busy, flag the crossing. Railroads have procedures for these things.

Fourth, as is obvious, drivers are unpredictable and do stupid things... a lot. Around flashers. So even if they worked perfectly, the chances of getting hit are considerable. So you're looking at an "all occupant kill/maim" if hit by an automobile moving at speed, even in a larger Fairmont speeder like an A-car. *A flying shingle, forget it*.

NARCOA is hardly the inventor of the "don't shunt" idea. They are simply continuing railroad practice of 70+ years, and complying with the rules of their hosts.

Shunting is the tip... of a much larger culture clash, between the "bandit-runner gang" who say "run anywhere I ain't caught" and the NARCOA gang who says "get permission, carry insurance". You must understand, those "my risk, my immortality" viewpoints are inherently incompatible with any organized group whose business is securing permission to run other people's rail lines.

When someone gets caught bandit-running, the authorities confiscate the speeder. As such, bandit-runners tend to use "expendable" home-brew cars or "flying shingles" as they're called in the community, rather than risk a historic Fairmont type speeder. Flying shingles are typically a "larry" flatcar or a homebrew platform+axles, plus Briggs lawnmower engine, couple of lawn chairs and a cooler. They tend to be pretty sketchy. If you want to see one, Youtube is full of them.

There was an accident in 1982? on the Adirondack Railroad where a Fairmont speeder collided with a flying shingle, both of them excessive speed / blind curve / not paying attention. The flying shingle occupants had to be med/evac'd by helicopter. I can only imagine what it took to get help, seeing as this was long before cell phones and 406 MHz ELTs.
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