From yesterday's rypn briefs: VISITING ENGINES AND EQUIPMENT

A roster of confirmed visiting locomotives and equitpment (sic) for the Fair will be finalized in January 2003.

So, question is not what engines are coming, but will Sandy be there for the big announcement? How about it, Sandy--have you got the Las Vegas odds makers warmed up? Jim



http://nctrans.org
Wrinnbo@aol.com

> So, question is not what engines are coming,
> but will Sandy be there for the big
> announcement? How about it, Sandy--have you
> got the Las Vegas odds makers warmed up?

I'm not even bothering with the oddsmakers--there actually has to be a RACE with horses showing up before we can call on the oddsmakers. <:-)

Seriously, though, if I haven't been barred from the property by that time, I'd be happy to report. Unfortunately, if the past inquiries on the subject--at a press conference and later passing remarks--are any indication, it's entirely conceivable that they could spend a half-hour just to NOT tell you who isn't attending. We're stuck trying to decide whether they're not letting the kittens out of the bag or whether there aren't any kittens in the bag to begin with.

I'm not bashing the B&O Museum here, but given the combination of:
*CSX being somewhat inhospitable to mainline steam and public relations in general;
*Other railroads shifting away from the old PR model of entertaining folks a la the NS steam program;
*The current insurance environment;
*The current economic environment in the United States; and
*The lack of certain news of substance coming out of the organizers (such as the arrival of major sponsors or a big cooperative push by CSX)..........

Then I am forced to equate the odds of a big no-holds-barred CSRM-Railfair-scope Fair of the Iron Horse as being right up there with finding a website tomorrow offering to broker any and all Cuban MINAZ steam locomotives for fair scrap value to any and all comers--administered by a Canadian or British company to make all transactions legal within U.S. law.

Now, Jim, just when are you going to tell us whether or not Slobberface, the SR FP7 and E8, and/or Shay 1925 are coming to the party?


lner4472@bcpl.net

Well, Sandy, I'd hate for you to be banned from the property. It wouldn't be a party without you. Let us pray for clemency.

I suspect that things will come together this spring, for better or worse. I have no insider knowledge, but I do recall that the final decision to go to California in 1999 and all the details between NCTM&F and CSRM&F weren't worked out until about five months before the show. That said, there's still plenty of time to line up some pretty cool stuff.

I think we could even load up a three-truck Shay and aim an E8 northbound as long as there's pork BBQ and refreshing cold beverages awaiting us at the other end of the trip. On that note, anybody seen HTTX 97425 (our 1999 Shay Sled) or know where I can find it? (Last time I checked, it was out in the Midwest hauling farm equipment.)

http://nctrans.org
Wrinnbo@aol.com

Hmmmm
And they've got the Tom Thumb replica.
Maybe with a better blower belt it'll win this time.

Electric City Trolley Museum Association

> A roster of confirmed visiting locomotives
> and equitpment (sic) for the Fair will be
> finalized in January 2003.

Spelling error corrected. For the record, it was mine, not the B&O Museum's. My sentence was a distillation of what was released on the Fair of the Iron Horse web site. The official full text reads as follows:

"Some of the most impressive and unique pieces of railroad history will be featured in this once in a lifetime event. The final roster of stars is close to completion. Please visit us again in January 2003 for a finalized list of what will be featured in the show. Once the final list is determined, an approximate length of the show will also be available. Right now the show is anticipated to run approximately 50 minutes."

eledbetter@rypn.org

Sandy, a fixation on CSX may leave you standing by the wrong lines. Other than giving John Snow tens of millions in a going awy present, I am not sure what old Chessie is up to.

But, there is more than one way to skin a cat, and there are four systems to move equipment to Baltimore: CSX, NS, CPR and Amtrak. Oh, yeah... and MARC. Ask a few folks in the northeast... CPR is a nice alternative to move equipment over the old D&H routes and rights. And a friendly commuter agency can do wonders, too.

In fact, I dare say that quite a bit of equipment could get into the city without needing CSX for anything but the local move. We'll see.

I have no idea how #261's move would be planned, but that's a perfect example of an engine that need not run on CSX until the city limits.

It's wonderful how interconnected regionals, tranist agencies and Amtrak can get you across the northeast. I have no specific information, but you can do some pretty interesting things via the Ohio Central, W&LE, BR&P, R&N, NEC, VRS, NJ Transit, Amtrak, D&H and Susie Q, no? Especially when all of them are excursion (and almost all steam) friendly?

Hmmm... And didn't #261 run on the BR&P on the return from Scranton. I can see a couple of gals from Wisconsin coming without contracting a US class 1. Hmm... #2816 could come into town on home rails and rights... The Ohio Central girls could do roundabout if needed...

Hmmm.... Sounds like we might not want to only stand by CSX grades, maybe?

;-)

Rob

> *CSX being somewhat inhospitable to mainline
> steam and public relations in general;
> *Other railroads shifting away from the old
> PR model of entertaining folks a la the NS
> steam program;
> *The current insurance environment;
> *The current economic environment in the
> United States; and
> *The lack of certain news of substance
> coming out of the organizers (such as the
> arrival of major sponsors or a big
> cooperative push by CSX)..........

> Then I am forced to equate the odds of a big
> no-holds-barred CSRM-Railfair-scope Fair of
> the Iron Horse as being right up there with
> finding a website tomorrow offering to
> broker any and all Cuban MINAZ steam
> locomotives for fair scrap value to any and
> all comers--administered by a Canadian or
> British company to make all transactions
> legal within U.S. law.

> Now, Jim, just when are you going to tell us
> whether or not Slobberface, the SR FP7 and
> E8, and/or Shay 1925 are coming to the
> party?


trains@robertjohndavis.com

NS still bgets a black eye from ending the steam program, but it seems that they've done some nice things with a certain pair of E-units on some freight-only lines, no? And not too far from Baltimore, eh?

;-)

Rob



trains@robertjohndavis.com

While I have no contacts within CSX, my impression is that they are not against steam engines, so long as they keep traffic moving, but they don't like the "attractive nuisance" of a steam engine on the line. A steamer attracts people to trackside, and goofballs put their lives in danger to get that perfect shot. Too much discussion has gone into allowing or not allowing revenue ferry moves. I'm sure the B&O Museum could care less about passenger trips or rare track mileage, as long as they show up for the event itself.

http://www.nps.gov/stea/
mustang746@earthlink.net

> I think we could even load up a three-truck
> Shay and aim an E8 northbound as long as
> there's pork BBQ and refreshing cold
> beverages awaiting us at the other end of
> the trip.

I think Bawlamer is jes' fur south enuf in the barbeque department that we can accommodate you (altho' the house specialties are crabs and "pit beef/ham").......... And we have five brewpubs in town, although none in a railroad station........ but you can see the Wharf Rat-Camden Yards from Camden Station..........

lner4472@bcpl.net

> But, there is more than one way to skin a
> cat, and there are four systems to move
> equipment to Baltimore: CSX, NS, CPR and
> Amtrak. Oh, yeah... and MARC. Ask a few
> folks in the northeast... CPR is a nice
> alternative to move equipment over the old
> D&H routes and rights. And a friendly
> commuter agency can do wonders, too.

> In fact, I dare say that quite a bit of
> equipment could get into the city without
> needing CSX for anything but the local move.
> We'll see.

I'm calling your bet. NS and CP get into town via Amtrak's Northeast Corridor, perhaps THE most inhospitable environment for foreign rail equipment of any kind save Amtrak-certified equipment. Remember, most Northeastern freight now moves on CSX between DC and Philly because no freight save local freight to local customers or disconnected freight lines (the Delmarva peninsula, for example) operates on the Corridor if at all possible (thanks again, Ricky Gates....).

Once in town, any visitors to the B&O Museum HAVE to get onto CSX to access the ready-made staging yard for the Fair, the Mt. Clare "A" Yard underneath Interstate 95 and on the other side of Carrollton Viaduct from the "First Mile". The ONLY places the CSX and NS/CP/Amtrak lines connect in Baltimore are PRR/WM at Fulton (at the west end of the B&P Tunnel, among the worst Corridor bottlenecks extant) and via convoluted contortions south of the Bayview Yards on the east side of town (both CSX and NS serve Canton, and if we look long enough we may be able to find a connecting switch).

No, far simpler for the connections to CSX to be made directly at Washington DC, Hagerstown, and/or Philadelphia, and have the trains scoot straight from there to Mt. Winans.

Frankly, I'm beginning to see why the British have been trucking steam locomotives from railroad to railroad rather than entrust the railroad companies to handle them.........

lner4472@bcpl.net

Tim,

You bring up an excellent point. When did the "ultimate photo" become such a driving force?

Now, before the pot dials up the kettle, I am not an innocent. My lenses have sought many a steam train.

However, when I think of my best steam experiences as a patron, I never think of a photo... I recall sounds, smells, feelings...

I gave up chasing excursion trains a while back, for several reasons. One - I'd rather buy a ticket and enjoy the ride. Two - I don't exactly know what to do with pictures of say, a China-built Mike passing an F-40 in central New Jersey. Three - I'd rather support the operators of that Mike so that it will be around for my son to experience.

The turning point for me was a weekend in Vriginia with N&W #1218. We chased her Saturday and rode Sunday. There were so many goofballs out on Saturday, that half-way through the chase, we bailed and went shortline hunting. You couldn't really enjoy the picture taking or the experience. However, the next day's ride and run-bys were fantastic. Worry-free and worth the price of admission. I have not gone on a wild hog chase since. Well, I did try once with #614 and Ross flat out beat me to every one of my favorite hideaways on the Erie. ;-)

You are exactly right, Tim. There is some fun in the ferry moves since they are odd, but the truth is, the engines that come have a job to do in Baltimore. Even if they came towed in under light steam. it would have no impact on the event.

And now a days, you've got to consider that a full out ferry move a la UP brings wackos and "professional wackos" in video vans, helicopters and even ultralights.

I will buy a ticket and plant my butt in the bleachers this summer, and let the good folks in Baltimore bring the show to me!

Rob

PS: Now, of course, if the MOT is secretly rebuilding DL&W #952 for the event, I might have to look into a hot air baloon to float over the Nicholson bridge... ;-)

trains@robertjohndavis.com

Once the participants are committed and the routes determined I volunteer to help any of the outfits get through Northern Ohio! Let me know how I can help!

lamontdc@adelphia.net

Will the C&O Greenbriar attend the party under steam? Seems rather sad to omit the only operating modern C&O/B&O Museum loco from such a gathering.

glueck@maine.edu

Big discussion about 614 status on railfan.net. Go to:
"Locomotives and Rolling Stock Index"
then "Steam Locomotives"
then "Fate of C&O 614?"
I wouldn't expect it at Baltimore next year.


hankmorris@earthlink.net

I can't imagine that unless the ownership issues is resolved and she's got a place to run again on a regular basis, that anyone is going to spend the money and time it would take to do a 1472-day inspection and any necessary repairs it might uncover. But it's a dandy thought, that's for sure.

http://nctrans.org
Wrinnbo@aol.com