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| Steam generator or boiler https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=48433 |
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| Author: | AndySchwering [ Mon Dec 02, 2024 8:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Steam generator or boiler |
Are there any leads on suppliers for our dedicated steam heat car? Currently running Vapor, @ 72 VDC. We are hoping to modernize into something serviceable far into the future. We are open to new voltages but will most likely stay with diesel fuel for the heat source. We think we need about 50 HP. We had a lead on a nice unit but when they found out it was in a moving train car, they refused to discuss any longer. Andy |
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| Author: | Alan Maples [ Mon Dec 02, 2024 9:51 pm ] | ||
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler | ||
Wilmington & Western converted a boxcar to a heater car using a commercial skid mounted steam generator from Sioux Corporation. https://sioux.com/steam-generators - Alan Maples
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| Author: | AndySchwering [ Mon Dec 02, 2024 11:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler |
Do you know their operating pressure? I have inquired to them on their contact page. In their product page it mentions a 15 psi max. We normally operate at 150 psi.... |
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| Author: | softwerkslex [ Tue Dec 03, 2024 5:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler |
AndySchwering wrote: Do you know their operating pressure? I have inquired to them on their contact page. In their product page it mentions a 15 psi max. We normally operate at 150 psi.... What pressure are you hoping to put in the trainline? In our Danish operation, the trainline steam is only like 10-20 psi. There is a regulator in the cab to step the pressure down. |
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| Author: | AndySchwering [ Tue Dec 03, 2024 7:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler |
According to the gauge in the steam heat car 150 PSI is needed to get heat to the end of the coaches. We currently run 7 coaches in our consist. We do have some leaks, but normally have no trouble keeping things warm. Parts are next to impossible to find, and service is just as bad. We do work with a local contractor, but if something is broken they show us what we need to get, and then tell us "Call us when you find one and we will come back and get it going." |
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| Author: | John Risley [ Tue Dec 03, 2024 10:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler |
I would recheck your facts about pushing 150 lbs of steam down range for heat. 10 PSI to maybe 20 PSI seems more in the ball park. Most steam heat systems are prone to leaks and I would think 150 PSI would look pretty awesome in a not so awesome way? Mid Continent RR museum has used a portable unit much like the one pictured. Mounted semi permanently in a repurposed GN RPO/steam heat car. But just about any car with room will work. With out some way to turn that 150 PSI down to a more workable pressure I would question your data? Good luck. https://www.midcontinent.org/equipment- ... rthern-90/ |
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| Author: | softwerkslex [ Tue Dec 03, 2024 1:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler |
AndySchwering wrote: According to the gauge in the steam heat car 150 PSI is needed to get heat to the end of the coaches. We currently run 7 coaches in our consist. We do have some leaks, but normally have no trouble keeping things warm. Parts are next to impossible to find, and service is just as bad. We do work with a local contractor, but if something is broken they show us what we need to get, and then tell us "Call us when you find one and we will come back and get it going." Are you venting steam at the end of the train? There has to be some flow from one end to the other for heat to travel. If the system is not venting at the last car, then the lines are just full of compressed air and condensate. There are also condensate drains on each car, that should be checked for operation. There has to be actual steam volume flow for heat transfer to occur. |
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| Author: | Bruce_Mowbray [ Tue Dec 03, 2024 1:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler |
With vapor systems, normal operating pressure at the cab is 2-4 PSI per car with a restricted valve at the rear car. The trick to not wrecking the system is the 75-100 PSI at startup to preheat the system before introducing the lower pressure to prevent condensate buildup, allowing all condensate to exit the rear of the train with the rear valve wide open. And 75-100 PSI at shutdown, though the wide open rear valve, to blow out any condensate and really dry out the system before shutting down to prevent overnight freeze ups. |
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| Author: | AndySchwering [ Tue Dec 03, 2024 6:02 pm ] | ||
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler | ||
We keep the rear open to keep steam moving. All cars have working steam traps. I know the bundles in the car only carry a few pounds of pressure. We normally operate all on, then all off. Conductors call for more less heat. Our Steam Generator manual clearly states keep train line steam pressure at 180 - 200 PSI Everything seems to work like this... We just want to start modernizing some equipment. Does anyone have manuals or instructions for operating the train side of the heating system?
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| Author: | EJ Berry [ Tue Dec 03, 2024 8:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam snowy afternoongenerator or boiler |
One snowy afternoon 31 stopped between Harrisburg and Altoona and I looked from a Dutch Door and saw each car leaking steam from the traps, couplings and anyplace else. You wontered if steam was going through the train or the train was going through the steam! Phil Mulligan |
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| Author: | AndySchwering [ Tue Dec 03, 2024 9:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam snowy afternoongenerator or boiler |
EJ Berry wrote: One snowy afternoon 31 stopped between Harrisburg and Altoona and I looked from a Dutch Door and saw each car leaking steam from the traps, couplings and anyplace else. You wontered if steam was going through the train or the train was going through the steam! Phil Mulligan We call that ambiance. |
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| Author: | EJ Berry [ Wed Dec 04, 2024 6:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler |
It took a lot of capacity to have that much leakage and still our car on the rear had comfortable heat. 2 ex-PRR E8's with 2 boilers each. It was late in the steam heat era but AMTK did not like E60's tracking West of Overbrook. Solution was to do the engine change to F40's at 30th St. with train hauled backwards between NYP and PHL. Then you could use HEP. Phil Mulligan |
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| Author: | choodude [ Thu Dec 05, 2024 12:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler |
EJ Berry wrote: AMTK did not like E60's tracking West of Overbrook. Phil Mulligan Back then there was miles and miles of beat down jointed rail on the Harrisburg line. E60's had speed restrictions that only applied to them. E60's had a concerning way of waddling side to side until it hit the rail and banged the other way. Brian Helfrich |
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| Author: | softwerkslex [ Thu Dec 05, 2024 4:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler |
AndySchwering wrote: We keep the rear open to keep steam moving. All cars have working steam traps. I know the bundles in the car only carry a few pounds of pressure. We normally operate all on, then all off. Conductors call for more less heat. Our Steam Generator manual clearly states keep train line steam pressure at 180 - 200 PSI Everything seems to work like this... We just want to start modernizing some equipment. Does anyone have manuals or instructions for operating the train side of the heating system? That manual must be wrong, or a typo. I can't imagine sending full boiler pressure down our trainline. It would be a safety hazard. I have participated in annual car inspection, and I would not trust our pipes to hold. The style of hose connections we use between cars are pretty delicate, as well. |
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| Author: | Jason Lamb [ Thu Dec 05, 2024 9:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steam generator or boiler |
The Everett Railroad runs a seven car train with 60 PSI of steam trainline pressure. The hoses between the cars are modern and steam rated. I had a copy of a PRR Passenger Car Heating book, which of course I can't find now. As I recall it specified 10 PSI per car in temperatures below freezing. If a passenger train were 20 cars long, pressures might be pretty high. I do have a copy of an IC Passenger Car Heating Rules book dated 1926 which specifies 10 PSI of steam trainline pressure per car in temperatures above 20 degrees, and 12 PSI per car when temperatures are below 20 degrees. On trains equipped with all rubber steam hose, steam trainline pressure may not exceed 130 PSI. On trains where the loco and first four cars are equipped with "metallic steam conduits" pressures of up to 170 PSI are allowed. Jason Lamb |
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