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Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
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Author:  jimwrinn [ Sun Feb 16, 2003 11:19 am ]
Post subject:  Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
Doing a little research here into the "good ole days" of early steam railway preservation, a time now referred to as "the 60s." I am reading the log of two New England railfans who made a southern sweep in June 1964 and this is part of their report: "Our next steop at Murphy NC was to see York Southern 4-6-0 No. 1. Find the engine tastefully painted Southern green with silver tires and gold lettering. An ex-Tenn. Central caboose recently repainted alos at Murphy. Much boiler and air brake work remains to be done on No. 1"

Anybody know what this was, where it came from, where it went, and why, off all the pool halls in America, they chose to restore it in an our of the way berg like greater Cherokee Co., N.C.?

A Q for an icy morning in the Carolinas. Jim

http://nctrans.org
Wrinnbo@aol.com
Author:  dave [ Sun Feb 16, 2003 1:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
Sounds like the old Clinchfield 4-6-0 to me Jim. can anybody verify?

Dave
Author:  John Craft [ Sun Feb 16, 2003 2:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
> Sounds like the old Clinchfield 4-6-0 to me
> Jim. can anybody verify?

That one occurred to me, but I think it went to Jackson long before 1964.

The other candidate that came to mind was GN 102. Dick Jensen got his hands on it around 1965 - maybe someone bought it from Norton and moved it to Murphy for a while?

And there's always the possibility that it didn't survive.

JAC
Author:  K.R. Bell [ Sun Feb 16, 2003 3:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
I believe the locomotive in question is ex-Hampton & Branchville 4-6-0 No. 32, painted for Byron Andrews' ill-fated York Southern Ry. The YS ran excursions on the Maryland & Pennsylvania RR in 1962-1963 using leased Ma & Pa diesel and two ex-Soo Line steel coaches. The Tennessee Central caboose was also owned by Andrews, but I'm not sure whatever became of it. I have a copy slide of the 4-6-0 and caboose at York on July 11, 1964 taken by Charles T. Mahan, Jr., so the engine must have been shipped to Pennsylvania shortly after those New England railfans made their visit to Murphy. In September 1964 George Hart's Rail Tours assumed excursion operations on the M&P and Andrews' equipment sat stored and unused at York until the late 1960s. The 4-6-0 was never used on the M&P and I was told by a reliable source that Andrews had been sold "a bag of goods" in which the boiler work claim was bogus. It was sold through court sale in 1968 to a York, Pa. scrap dealer who, in turn, sold it to Richard Jensen of Chicago. I believe the engine is still in storage somewhere in the windy city.

K.R. Bell

> Doing a little research here into the
> "good ole days" of early steam
> railway preservation, a time now referred to
> as "the 60s." I am reading the log
> of two New England railfans who made a
> southern sweep in June 1964 and this is part
> of their report: "Our next steop at
> Murphy NC was to see York Southern 4-6-0 No.
> 1. Find the engine tastefully painted
> Southern green with silver tires and gold
> lettering. An ex-Tenn. Central caboose
> recently repainted alos at Murphy. Much
> boiler and air brake work remains to be done
> on No. 1"

> Anybody know what this was, where it came
> from, where it went, and why, off all the
> pool halls in America, they chose to restore
> it in an our of the way berg like greater
> Cherokee Co., N.C.?

> A Q for an icy morning in the Carolinas. Jim
Author:  Tom Cornillie [ Sun Feb 16, 2003 4:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0 *PIC*
This locomotive is presently at the Monticello Railway Museum. Before this it was owned by William Lathom of Rockford, IL. In 2000, he donated this locomotive as well as nee-CMSTP&P NW-2 # 1649 to the museum. Lathom still has some other nee-CMSTP&P MofW rolling stock in Rockford, including the modified commuter coach mentioned in a thread below. He also has a former Belt Railway of Chicago steam big-hook that, if I remember correctly, was being made available for donation.

The picture below, by Kam Miller via George Elwood's fallen-flags website, shows the locomotive in storage on the Chicago West Pullman & Southern in 1981.

The link is to the issue of the Monticello Railway Museum's newsletter, the "Second Section," which discusses (with pictures) the dontation of the aforementioned locomotives by Lathom.

Best,
Tom Cornillie

August_September 2000 Second Section
Image
rrhistorian@hotmail.com
Author:  Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Sun Feb 16, 2003 4:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0 *PIC*
MAN, can you come up with a challenge........

Many years ago, I sent a correspondent in Chicago after this loco. At the time it was still reported as being the property of the late Dick Jensen, who had purchased it at court sale from a party in York, Pa. where it had been intended to run on a part of the old Ma & Pa. The correspondent never found it, in part because its last reported storage location was "100th St. near Torrance Avenue, south Chicago", a territory not too far from Englewood where punks reportedly have fire-hydrant eating contests and nobody valuing their body goes alone. (I can confirm that, having been in the area a year or two ago on railroad business.)

The loco, Baldwin #43334 of May 1916, was built as Mississippi Eastern 303 and later gained fame and notoriety as Hampton & Branchville 32, a sister to the Charleston Chapter NRHS's 44. It's now at the Monticello Railway Museum in pretty heavily stripped condition, having arrived there in June 2000. Below is a photo of her as she was on the H&B in 1962, a year before her trip to York, as well as a link to a more current photo.

FYI, this took me well over an hour of research and web searches, even knowing all the relevant history information off the top of my head!

Photo of her at Monticello
Image
lner4472@bcpl.net
Author:  dave [ Sun Feb 16, 2003 5:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
Anybody from Monticello got your ears on?

What are the chances of bringing her home to the southeast if you don't have any conservation or rstoration in the works?

dave
Author:  Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Sun Feb 16, 2003 7:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
> What are the chances of bringing her home to
> the southeast if you don't have any
> conservation or rstoration in the works?

1) Nothing says restoration is not in the works. Monticello is a competent museum, and although it may take a while, 32 is a very desirable loco for an excursion operation, in terms of size and general appearance.

2) The South Carolina RR Museum already has sister 44 to work on and play with. I can't see steam excursions on the H&B. Do you have another offer of a good home? (Hmmmmm, maybe TVRM wants a handsome 4-6-0? Nah, they already have L&A 509. . . .)

lner4472@bcpl.net
Author:  dave [ Sun Feb 16, 2003 8:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
That's why I said "if" Sandy. What was the H&B isn't anymore anyhow - they now run on the old ACL. SCRM would love to have 44 up and running but they haven't the resources to do so at this time. They do a nice job of maintaining her however.

Nothing specific in mind - just nice to know if it is a possibility. So much got moved around in the early days of steam in preservation.

Dave
Author:  John Craft [ Mon Feb 17, 2003 9:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
> (Hmmmmm, maybe TVRM wants a handsome 4-6-0?
> Nah, they already have L&A 509. . . .)

Sandy, there's been a 4-6-0-shaped hole at Grand Junction for several months now. It's now on display at Cookeville, TN.

JAC
Author:  John W. Coniglio [ Mon Feb 17, 2003 7:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
Does anyone remember which TC caboose that was? And on that subject, TC had a "Road of Personal Service" round emblem with TC in the center on at least one caboose. What other rolling stock had it and when was its use discontinued?

JWC

that other Chattanooga website
mail@steamvalley.com
Author:  Peter Nicholson [ Tue Feb 18, 2003 1:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Another 60s-era steam Q: York Sou. 4-6-0
> 1) Nothing says restoration is not in the
> works. Monticello is a competent museum, and
> although it may take a while, 32 is a very
> desirable loco for an excursion operation,
> in terms of size and general appearance.

Currently, the steam folks at Monticello are busy with Southern 2-8-0 #401, and probably will be for quite a while. If someone had something that ran in Central Illinois to trade for #32, they would probably be willing to talk.

pnichol6@prodigy.net
Author:  L Beckman [ Fri Feb 21, 2003 4:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Englewood vs. 100th and Torrance
> MAN, can you come up with a
> challenge........

> Many years ago, I sent a correspondent in
> Chicago after this loco. At the time it was
> still reported as being the property of the
> late Dick Jensen, who had purchased it at
> court sale from a party in York, Pa. where
> it had been intended to run on a part of the
> old Ma & Pa. The correspondent never
> found it, in part because its last reported
> storage location was "100th St. near
> Torrance Avenue, south Chicago", a
> territory not too far from Englewood where
> punks reportedly have fire-hydrant eating
> contests and nobody valuing their body goes
> alone. (I can confirm that, having been in
> the area a year or two ago on railroad
> business.)

ADM: 100th and Torrance is a far piece from Englewood! I photographed the 4-6-0 (and other equipment) on a number of occasions at that time and, although not the greatest neighborhood, never felt threatened while at 100th and Torrance.
I realize that you are not a Chicagoan, but please try to get your facts somewhat straight. Thanks.



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