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| Missing White Pass Mikados https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=5487 |
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| Author: | Bob Yarger [ Wed Mar 26, 2003 3:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Missing White Pass Mikados |
Those interested in the White Pass & Yukon have pondered for some time over the actual fate of three 2-8-2s that came when the Army took over the line during WWII. These were among the 11 USATC types that were built (or rebuilt, it's unclear) in 1944 by Baldwin for use on the line. Of the 11, the following survived: 190 operable at Tweetsie RR 192 operable at Dollywood 195 display at Skagway 196 dumped as rip rap along Skagway River 191,193,194,197 were reportedly scrapped at Skagway in 1951 198,199,200 were reportedly scrapped at Seattle in 1945, but later information said they were resold to Peru. At long last, New Zealander John Agnew (who produces excellent narrow gauge locomotive kits in Sn3 scale) has provided photos of two of the engines at a sugar mill in Peru, in the 1970s. It is unclear if they still exist. As these were the only unaccounted locomotives from the total production that were built to 3' gauge, they must be the missing engines. All the other USTAC narrow gauge 2-8-2s were built to meter or 42" gauge. This design was the only known production locomotive to have served on all of the major continents in the World. White Pass 2-8-2s in Peru ryarger@rypn.org |
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| Author: | JohnHillier [ Wed May 14, 2014 9:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
Would it be possible to find a working link to the photos of the engines in Peru? |
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| Author: | p51 [ Wed May 14, 2014 11:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
As far as I understand it, the WP locomotives scrapped after the war were not scrapped in Seattle, but close by. They were scrapped in the NP yard at Auburn, WA. I know ET&WNC #s 10 and 14 were scrapped there along with some of the DRG stuff they sent south. |
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| Author: | Trevor Heath [ Thu May 15, 2014 6:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
John Hiller, This is the reply from John Agnew in New Zealand. I asked him about this subject directly when the link did not work.... "Trevor what / whose images are these? And what link is this? You have lost me? We are just about to go away for the weekend, back Monday, regards John" TH |
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| Author: | Alan Walker [ Thu May 15, 2014 7:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
I suppose that if someone really wants to, they could fish the 196 out of the river and rebuild her. It would be a significant task but it has been done before-the Kiwis did it with a rare locomotive down under. |
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| Author: | solar1953 [ Thu May 15, 2014 8:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
I was under the impression that at least the frame and running gear of a second 2-8-2 from the WP&Y was at Dollywood. Am I mistaken? |
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| Author: | Trevor Heath [ Fri May 16, 2014 7:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
Now I wonder exactly on who's list these three loco's were unaccounted for..... "These locos ended up on the Ferrocarril Casa Grande-Sausal of Chicama, Peru in 1948. There is a picture of one of them (198 as FCGS 32) in "World of South American Steam" published in 1974 which stated that they were out of use but serviceable." TH |
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| Author: | Mike Stillwell [ Fri May 16, 2014 9:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
The remains at Dollywood are from 70 series class locomotive #72. I beleive I read a few years ago that the frame itself was scrapped and only the drivers, saddle and rods are still there as spares for 70 and 71. Mike Stillwell Buena Vista, VA. |
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| Author: | JohnHillier [ Fri May 16, 2014 9:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
The frame still exists but it was cut in half, and I don't believe anything remains of the cylinder castings. Still, there's enough left. Also, I believe the 70 is currently running on the 72's drivers. Trevor, thanks for the investigation. I look forward to whatever is dug up. |
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| Author: | Trevor Heath [ Fri May 16, 2014 9:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
John, Are you up in Skagway? Is the 73 repaired and back in service? TH |
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| Author: | H.O. [ Fri May 16, 2014 10:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
I'm not sure that I would say that No. 195 is "on display." It seems to have been shoved onto a siding back in the weeds behind the Town Hall. When I saw it two years ago it seemed to be in pretty rough shape - and basically covered in rust. |
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| Author: | daleperu [ Sat May 17, 2014 12:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
I travel to Peru frequently. All railroads north of Lima have been abandoned. Some of the private sugar mills held on till the late 70's. However as the tracks were pulled up, equipment got scrapped. I think I saw one picture from someone in Peru that showed the boiler of one WP&Y engine sitting on the ground in early 2000 or was earlier. Very little rail equipment has been saved or what has is in very poor condition. Dale Brown |
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| Author: | GaryPBensman [ Sat May 17, 2014 2:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
Also in "World of South American Steam" was a photo in the shops of the Sea Dock Company of Pimentel, Peru showing an 1878 Rogers 4-4-0. What a treasure that loco would be to preserve! Any recent info on the locos still at Pimentel? I can see the dock and shops still exist on Google Earth. |
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| Author: | JohnHillier [ Sat May 17, 2014 3:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
That's interesting. We could hope the engine was recognized as "old enough" to possibly be saved. The 73 is running, I heard it leave town this morning. I'm all the way at the bottom of the extra board so I wasn't aware they were going to run up the hill today. |
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| Author: | daleperu [ Sun May 18, 2014 12:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Missing White Pass Mikados |
I was in Puerto Eten nearly 10 years ago. The former station and shops were there and in very diserted conditions. However the town wanted to estabilish a rail museum. The four steam locos were in the enginehouse including the Roger's. Most of the equipment at that time had been scavenged for any valuable parts. However I think some builders plates were still on some. There is usually no real pride in saving anything historic in Peru. The general rule is; if it's old tear it down or scrap it since it is in the way. Other than the Tacna-Arica Railroad which has a Railroad Museum, there is little in the way of preserved trains. Dale Brown |
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