Very well put, T.J. I know exactly where you're coming from. Even though I'm 31, I still experience the funny age treatment thing sometimes. In virtually all of the rail preservation groups I've ever been affiliated with (with the exception of one or two), young folks were frowned upon or not taken seriously by some of the older folks. But among the kids there have been some shining stars. I once saw a 5 year old railfan talk turkey about a UP Big Boy and left the museum docent speechless! So never assume young people are clueless--they lack real life experience, yes, but they are looking for validation in older members and wish to cultivate a shared interest in the stewardship of history. I first started as a volunteer at age 15 restoring a narrow gauge wooden combine, and have since worked my way up to being Archivist at a major state-run railroad museum. There are opportunities in the field for young folks to pursue. But you touch on a very alarming trend--not many young people are coming up the ranks. We are struggling with this issue at RRMPA all the time.

As someone actively working in the railway museum trenches everyday and wrestling with some real challenges that museums face, in my opinion, I have observed that the BIGGEST threats facing rail preservation (in the broader context) are the following:

1. No money (or lack of professional staff in place to do fundraising to make programs at all levels possible)
2. Mother Nature (all of our iron and steel is slowly rusting away to pieces without cover or proper climate control)
3. Lots of greying heads and few youth coming up the ranks. (Today's "Thomas" fans have at least ten more years before "coming of age" to volunteer!)

It's that simple, really.> Again, great topic. We have had some doozy's
> lately. Some of my own comments if I may:

> I've gotten to know Dave pretty well over
> the past couple of years, and although he
> does point to the fact you can dwell on the
> past or the negative, I should note how much
> it surprised and saddened me when I first
> met him to hear that he had experienced many
> of the negative things I had experienced,
> both in the same organization and in others
> very similar to it. There is no question it
> is a different world from when even he and I
> (a difference of only a couple of years)
> were teenagers: the insurance/ liability was
> much less, but the writing was already on
> the wall.
> Its tough trying to both explain you have
> some knowledge and yet not seem pompous; god
> forbid if you correct an older member on an
> engine number, wheel arrangement, etc. Youth
> doesn't always have to equal ignorance, as
> long as that youth is willing to LISTEN as
> well as speak.

> Both Dave and I experienced the fact that
> rather than deal with the issue of getting
> younger people involved head-on, the
> organizations backed away, just about
> denying anyone under the age of 18 ANY
> opportunity to work there. I was fortunate
> enough to have had some members of a certain
> local NRHS chapter take me under there wing
> at the age of 9; I was "working"
> trips (helping to get things, sweeping cars,
> wokring as a an apprentice chef, etc.) under
> their close observation and tutelage, and
> although I know many of you would scough at
> the age I just stated, they saw something in
> me that they wished to both foster and
> expand: a love of steam, railroad in
> general, and the will to volunteer. Sadly,
> after five solid years of working these
> trips, it was decided by a newer group of
> individuals that anyone under 18 wasn't
> worth the effort, and although I later
> received apologies, I and two others were
> dropped like a hot potato, and told to come
> back at 18. By then, my attitude was, well,
> I think you can guess.

> I did move on to other groups, but I've
> never forgotten what it feels like to be
> treated that way, and for no good reason. I
> would have been happy sweeping cars; (and
> was) they wanted a "good-ole-boy"
> club, and now I see sadly notice that this
> groups 2004 trips may be their last.

> Having said this, members of that same group
> worked very hard to find me other avenues
> and other groups to help, and for that I'm
> forever grateful. I've tried to help other
> young people interested in rail opportunites
> when I can, especially if they show a real
> interest. I think that the attitude is
> really beginning to change within the
> community towards bringing ALL AGES on
> board; and there are significant milestones.
> I would have loved to have the opportunity
> of rail camp; to meet the "names"
> that I heard in TRAINS magazine, RAILWAY
> PRESERVATION NEWS, and others. Maybe I
> wouldn't have been so awestruck when I
> finally did meet some of these individuals
> back at ARM/TRAIN in 2001 ;-) Guys who,
> well, post here on a regular basis.

> I guess my long-windedness is saying that
> the survival of rail preservation begins
> with what we are doing here; getting serious
> about the issues that re facing the
> community in both the present and the
> future. There is no discrimination of
> thought here: many of us may think that and
> idea is pretty nutty, but we are still
> allowed to voice it and add our own two
> cents to the opinions being weighed. I'm
> honored (and I realize that sounds cheesy,
> but I'm a chessy guy at times) to be able to
> speak my view on such a wonderful forum as
> this, with gentlemen and women who both
> influenced and sahped my career path, even
> though they might not know they did. Thank
> you to Erik, Bob, and the countless other
> who literarily give us the opportunity to do
> that every single hour of every single day
> if we so choose.

> T.J.

Can "Black River" send me a list of questions that were developed to anaylze the volunteer program at an undisclosed tourist railroad / railroad museum?

Some of those questions can only be geared to the railroad volunteer world but some other questions or ways to look at the volunteer program have applications in other settings.

I need to send this out to people in the agricultural museum setting and a POW camp museum setting.

Thanks.



hugh.clayton@nara.gov