Hi all.

Does anyone know the condition of Western Maryland 202 on display in Hagerstown, Maryland? From a quick internet search, it shows the main rods have been disconnected to "roll out the locomotive every year for lubrication". Is this a preemptive attempt at a full (operative) restoration?

Just curious...

-Joe Comer

josephcomer@hotmail.com

AFAIK, which isn't very far, the railroad display at Hagerstown and 202 in particular have been under the particular care of one gentleman whose name escapes me. I beleive his work extends only to keeping the engine in good cosmetic shape and keeping the running gear from freezing up. There are no plans for an operating restoration. I welcome corrections if I'm under a misimpression.



eledbetter@rypn.org

The 202 is under the care of a fellow named John Long. He got control of the engine around 1980 and started a restoration to running condition. From what he told me the restoration was completed and the engine certified by the FRA. However he had no intention of operating it beyond the short piece of track that has been extended out in front of the locomotive's display site. This is a direct contrast to his original stated intention of operating the 202 "somewhere". In the mean time he bought and moved to the site several cabooses and now refers to the site as a museum. The 202 has been moved up and down the existing track at least a few times but as far as I know has never been fired up.

As I recall he had some members of Ross Rowland's crew working on the locomotive and they removed the appliances and took them to the Hagerstown roundhouse for repairs. I think they were using Ross's tools for much of the work. A retired WM boilermaker was in charge of the boiler work and another retired WM pipe fitter was also involved in supervising the job.

It is my guess the locomotive is pretty close to runable although I do not know its actual condition. Of course any boiler work that was done will now have to be done over since this was all prior to the new Part 230 rules. Perhaps the best thing Mr. Long has managed to do is convince the city to build a shelter over the locomotive. Similarly the worst thing he may have done is put lagging back on the boiler. At least it is fiberglass.

Frankly this is a rather sad story of what could have been. Had Mr. Long removed the engine from the park and then returned it to service the possibility at leasts exists that it could be operating today. Who would not love to see 202 doubleheaded with the 734 on the WM Scenic? In years past there existed the possibility of operating it on the Maryland Midland and probably a few other places.

John Bohon

jhbohon@yahoo.com

so John B (and others)-are you saying that because the gentleman convinced the city to put a shelter over the loco-that the city won't release it to operate on the Western Maryland Scenic? Or does the gentleman solely control the shots, and at this point doesn't appear interested in running on the WMS? I understand the challenges of current regulatory requirements-I'm just having trouble putting together the pieces of why running on the WMS isn't in the picture.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't 202 the last remaining Western Maryland steam loco?

If so, it would seem terribly fitting for it to be run on the WMSR...

Does the city of Hagerstown still own the engine?

josephcomer@hotmail.com

There's also Shay #6 at Cass Scenic.

bowens@rypn.org

> Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't 202 the
> last remaining Western Maryland steam loco?
> If so, it would seem terribly fitting for it
> to be run on the WMSR...
> Does the city of Hagerstown still own the
> engine?

As Boyd says, there is also the shay at Cass-they are the only two.

Yes, the City of Hagerstown owns the engine. Yes, it would be terrific to see it on Helmstetter's curve, but realistically it is not going to happen for the forseeable future. The prior management of the WMSRR explored the idea and was pretty firmly rebuffed by Hagerstown.

Since then, the WMSRR has had to reorganize its operations to address some cash-flow issues; presently they are running steam on one train a day four days a week during most of the season, and can't really justify adding another engine economically. I beleive this year they are focussed on maintaining ridership, growing it if possible, and watching to see what impact the bike trail is going to have on their business. They made tremendous strides in the 1990s, but now I get the sense that they are in watch, wait, and defend mode, not dream big mode.

I want to emphasize that the above is all my opnion as an outside observer very casually acquainted with some WMSRR people over the years. It does not reflect any insider knowledge and may be not entirely reliable.


eledbetter@rypn.org

Forgot about the Shay! My apologies...

As for the WMSR, I went to college at Frostburg... watched and heard 734 alot over those years.

The overall condition of the Frostburg depot seemed to have notably deteriorated over the years I was there at school. By the time I graduated in 2000, paint was peeling everywhere and the place was beginning to take on a sort of dowdy appearance.

A far cry from 1996 ... 4 short years earlier when everything seemed shiny, new, and tip top.

I wonder who owns/manages/runs the depot?



josephcomer@hotmail.com

Owned by Allegany County since 1998; purchased with money from the State of Maryland. The deal was very widely criticized at the time--many people felt it amounted to an inflated bailout of the restaruant owner, who was a crony of then-Speaker of the (MD) House Caspar Taylor.

The stink over the depot purchase may have even played a role in Taylor's not being reelected two years ago, which was an earthquake in Maryland politics--I mean, when in living memory had the Speaker of the House lost his own district election?

eledbetter@rypn.org

Wow. Didn't realize it was such a political battle. I'm assuming the original restaurant owner went under due to lack of business? I never saw anyone in there unless the train was in. They had pretty decent food, I remember...

Quite frankly, the depot is so tucked away down the hill I can see how it would be easy for non-railroad types to miss it. Its a shame its not more visible from main street.

josephcomer@hotmail.com

> Wow. Didn't realize it was such a political
> battle. I'm assuming the original restaurant
> owner went under due to lack of business?

Oh, yes, battle royal. Made the Washington Post--link below.

Md. Speaker Pushed Deal for Friend
eledbetter@rypn.org

> so John B (and others)-are you saying that
> because the gentleman convinced the city to
> put a shelter over the loco-that the city
> won't release it to operate on the Western
> Maryland Scenic? Or does the gentleman
> solely control the shots, and at this point
> doesn't appear interested in running on the
> WMS? I understand the challenges of current
> regulatory requirements-I'm just having
> trouble putting together the pieces of why
> running on the WMS isn't in the picture.

I wish I knew the answers to your questions. Back when this all started John Long purchased the engine from the city for $1.00, more or less over night. Every indication I got from both public sources and Mr. Long was that he owned the engine and the only stipulation was that he returned it to the city either when he died or when he no longer wanted it. He told me he was free to operate it as desired but the city wanted to be able to use the engine should a suitable oppertunity arise.

I have not talked to Mr. Long in at least ten years but from what I gather from the press the engine is again fully in the possession of the city. Additionally Mr. Long has apparently been a part time employee of the city as caretaker of the 202 for most if not all of these years and has donated his salary to a fund to maintain the 202. I am aware the city was approached some time ago by WM Scenic and I am told Mr. Long was very opposed to the engine going there though I have no idea why.

To say the least this has been an unusual arrangement. I do not pretend to understand what is going on. Apparently Mr. Long is somewhat pollitically connected with the city and has managed to do some very positive things with 202. But if he did actually own the engine and have the right to remove it from the park as he stated the posssibility of it operating on WM Scenic would seem to have been a natural.

As I have said before on this board I am from a WM family and dearly love this locomotive. I am disappointed if an opertunity to see it operate has been lost but am thrilled to see it getting far more care than most park engines. I must admit I would love to know what has really transpired over the last 20 years. If anyone has more information I would love to hear it.

John Bohon

jhbohon@yahoo.com

> ... an earthquake in Maryland politics--I mean,
> when in living memory had the Speaker of the
> House lost his own district election?

Big plans for the WMSR, Canal Place, and Alleghany County lost a friend when, like (former incumbent) U.S. Senators Bob Matthias (MD) and Joe Clark (PA) before him, Mr. Taylor came out in favor of gun control.

bruceman2@earthlink.net