I don't think it is just our operaton but we are having a tough time trying to get volunteers these days. We used to have a full roster of people to help staff trains and help with other rail preservation projects. Anyone else have any thoughts, suggestions?
-GP

midh91@hotmail.com

> I don't think it is just our operaton but we
> are having a tough time trying to get
> volunteers these days. We used to have a
> full roster of people to help staff trains
> and help with other rail preservation
> projects. Anyone else have any thoughts,
> suggestions?
> -GP

1. Let your visitors know you're hard up for help. We've gotten several volunteers that way -- in fact that's how I got into the hobby. They mentioned they needed help at the now-defunct Penn's Landing Trolley one time when I rode. I moved up to Philly for two years just to volunteer there.

2. Once someone fills out a membership form and indicates a desire to get active, CALL THEM. There are a few gutsy types who join and show up on their own, but most people like to be asked to come help. Call them, tell them when to show up, and find out what they're interested in doing. Then make sure you really put them to work when they actually show up. The worst thing to do is let a new recruit stand around, wondering what they can do to help.


mconrad@msmgmt.com

> I don't think it is just our operaton but we
> are having a tough time trying to get
> volunteers these days. We used to have a
> full roster of people to help staff trains
> and help with other rail preservation
> projects. Anyone else have any thoughts,
> suggestions?
> -GP

Your message implies that this didn't used to be a problem. Matt has some good suggestions. Back in December Erik Ledbetter posted an interesting message: "Doom and Gloom, or, Where We're At". You might want to read that message thread and then think about a few things regarding your organization.

Having been a volunteer at several non-profit organizations, including a couple of railroad museums, here are the questions I suggest you ask yourself about your organization:

1) What do you do to make new folks feel welcome and appreciated?

2) Do you actively try to involve new people in your organization?

3) Is your organization an "old boys club"?

4) Do new volunteers feel like they actually have a chance of moving up the ladder in a reasonable amount of time?

5) Does your organization have rigid "seniority" system that allows "senior" volunteers to show up and "bump" people from tasks or crew assignments that they've worked hard to achieve?

6) Does your organization have one or two "resident" volunteers that "run off" or intimidate (or just out right turn off) anyone not to their liking? These people are often "know it alls" that don't.

7) Are most, or all, of your more interesting (or high visibility) projects the sole domain of a small clique of "insiders" who don't tolerate, or won't make any effort to work with (and/or bad mouth) new comers?

8) As Matt suggests, do you try to contact and inform new (or existing) volunteers of current projects.

9) Do you only call/involve new volunteers to do the dirty jobs that your organization's "old timers" feel are beneath them? (corollary to question 5).

10) Have you contacted any of your former/inactive volunteers to try to find out why they no longer, or seldom, show up?

BlackRiver@nowhere.com

Here in San Diego, we are down about 50% over the past 15 years. It's hard to get the younger volunteers as the older ones retire/pass away.

Jim

Jim@sdrm.org

Wonder how many readers of this spot-on previous post felt a knot in their throat as they reviewed this question list? Black River has hit the nail (spike?) squarely on the head.

I'm not currently involved with any museum, but I might suggest that museums with a little track and operable locomotives offer throttle time as an inducement to put in volunteer hours. Some accurate record of time worked would need to be kept, possibly with a time clock and volunteer employee time cards. Not sure how you'd handle those making retroactive claims for previous work, but it would seem an inducement for newcomers - so many hours of volunteer work for an hour in the seat. Has anyone tried this?

ryarger@rypn.org

I read most of the messages on this board, but I usually do not respond. You all have forgotten more about trains that I know.

However, I do know something about volunteer organizations, having been a part of a cub scout troop, a peer counseling organization, a fire company and, yes a railroad museum.

The best of these was my time at the Railroad Museum of Pennsylvania. I am not there anymore, but it remains one of the best work experiences of my working life.

Robert Emerson was museum director for most of the time I was there. He never passed me without speaking, and several times thanked me for volunteering. Not only that , all volunteers recieved a letter from him that made it sound like the place would fall apart without us. It was so nice to be appreciated by the boss, and sadly that happens so infrequently these days.

Another plus was the restoration crew boss, Al Martin. He told you what he wanted done, how he wanted it done, why he wanted it done that way and where he would be if you had a question. Then, he left you to it. If someone showed up unexpectedly, Al had something for them to do.It made for a nice environment.

I hope to get back into working around trains someday. When I do, I will look for an environment like I found in Strasburg in the mid 1990's. By the way - I can't forget the volunteer co ordinator in those days. He always had time to listen to comments and made an effort to let volunteers know they were appreciated and needed. Guy by the name of Kurt Bell. Hi Kurt, one day I'll stop by for a visit!

wtl1959@aol.com

Back in December Erik Ledbetter
> posted an interesting message: "Doom
> and Gloom, or, Where We're At". You
> might want to read that message thread and
> then think about a few things regarding your
> organization.

Thanks for the kind endorsement. UNfortunately the original post I made fell just beyond our last cutoff for offline archiving of the Interchange. One of the things we are working on this year is changing the Interchange back end to allow restoration of all posts back to the beginning--we do have them on CD-R backup. BlackRiver, did you by any chance save a copy of that post offline? If so, would you copy and paste it? If not, I'll get a copy of the post from Hume once he gets back from Korea (he's off lookign for the Erie Pacific this week).

eledbetter@rypn.org

A couple of stories. Good luck getting to the end of this. ;-)

If anyone is having trouble getting volunteers, may I suggest that they visit the good folks at Heber City, UT? I have done that a couple of times; (and hope to do more still) and am totally impressed at their professionalism, their openness, and the "good vibes" around the place.

Just go and "help" and watch. Fly in to Salt Lake City, rent a car, drive the hour to Heber City, and sleep in a caboose.

They treat everyone with respect, even us Canadians. ;-)

When I go to places to help (usually I'm there because of work, and I have a weekend or so free) I go with the attitude of "what can I do for YOU?" I will do anything; I have installed toilets; I have helped rebuild Shays. I talk, I ask, I observe, and I do. I check my ego at the front gate.

There are other good places; (that's you IronBarTom - see you in April ;-) but I don't really know what their official volunteer status is, so I'll not "advertise" for them.

Observing what others do is a fantastic way of learning what works, and what doesn't.

One place, that shall remain nameless, has 2 working CP steam locomotives, runs steam passenger trains, but anyone who I have talked to who has volunteered there has walked away - they wanted to do some "fun" things, but were turned off by the class hierarchy, and spent their time sweeping floors and cleaning toilets, not, touching trains.

I have not experienced volunteering at this place personally, but once talking to a fireman, and mentioned that I worked firing ex. cpr 1201, I was told that our group "destroyed" the firebox, and were incompetent. The man who is in charge of 1201 says that this is blatantly untrue.

So, I go up and talk to the crew, and I get told off with what are, most likely, lies. Was I impressed at the friendly atmosphere? You decide.

John Stewart
Ottawa, Canada



freewrl-1@rogers.com

Bob;

That is exactly how we operate "our" shay, and how we chose crews for ex.CPR 1201 when she was running.

Because we are volunteering in a Canadian Federal Museum, we have to have accurate records of volunteering time. (Insurance, etc, etc) Generally these records are taken and steam rosters are kind of squeezed from it.

*Everyone* running the train on run days gets time at the throttle - at least an hour or so every day. (There always in an "old boys club" but most actively try to squash any attempts for it to surface - life's too short for such antics)

The only down side is that anyone in the cab when running *has* to be a member of the volunteer society or a Museum employee.

> I'm not currently involved with any museum,
> but I might suggest that museums with a
> little track and operable locomotives offer
> throttle time as an inducement to put in
> volunteer hours. Some accurate record of
> time worked would need to be kept, possibly
> with a time clock and volunteer employee
> time cards. Not sure how you'd handle those
> making retroactive claims for previous work,
> but it would seem an inducement for
> newcomers - so many hours of volunteer work
> for an hour in the seat. Has anyone tried
> this?


Shay running.
freewrl-1@rogers.com

Some good points, John.

One thing to keep in mind is that due to insurance requirements, one may have to be a member of the organization in order to volunteer, especially if the work involves more than "sweeping up". And, don't expect to show up in shorts and sneakers and go out on a track crew or turn a wrench on the chooch in the shop.

That said, it is very important for the casual or first time "drop-in" person to feel welcome, and that his/her work is appreciated. Think back to the first time YOU ever went to one of these places, and how you were treated.

hpincus@mindspring.com

Black River makes some good points. But beyond the hospitality issues, I have observed chnages in the interests of active and potential volunteers.

Based on my experience at National Capital Trolley Museum, and also at church, I have found that most younger volunteers (defined as unedr 55 and having full-time employement) are interested in helping with a specific task, but do not want to commit to and extended period of service. i.e. the days of a regular weekly or monthly track crew are few and far between, but folks will respond to a call to come out for a periodic one-day blitz. The same is true at church - folks will help with an event: dinner, flea market, participate in worship as a leader - but they don't want to be part of a team that meets regularly to plan the events during the year.

Yes, this is a generalization, but it seems consistent in all areas that I have been involved with in the last 7-10 years: arts, museums, community service groups, etc.

Wesley

> BlackRiver, did you by any chance save a
> copy of that post offline? If so, would you
> copy and paste it?

Here you go...

-----------------------------------

Doom and Gloom, or, Where We're At

Posted By: Erik Ledbetter
Date: Wednesday, 17 December 2003, at 9:08 a.m.

I've been thinking for a few days about the "Tip of the Iceberg" thread Bob started below. Here's my take.

There is no doubt that these are tough times financially--AAM reports that for the first time ever, operating income, fundraising/endowment income, and government support were all down simultaneously for museums nationwide. But in the grander scheme of things, this is nothing new. The economy will always have business cycles; we've wethered them before and we will face them again.

What's of more interest to me are some other trends and changes that I think are fundamentally reshaping the environment in which we work. Among the major trends I see:

1. Mainline steam as we knew it from the 60s through the 80s is functionally dead, driven to extinctions by class 1 capacity limitations, insurance, and a host of other factors too numerous to mention

2. The tourist railroad industry is facing a major shakeout. Equiptment acquired in the 1960s in relatively operable shape is now thoroughly depreciated. Lines which cannot earn enough to reinvest in renewing their equipment will go to the wall. And, it's becoming harder to earn that money in the face of increasing competition for the recreational entertainment dollar.

3. Many museum operations face the same basic struggle as the tourist railroads--inability to bring in enough money to maintain their collections and physical plant in acceptable condition for the long haul.

4. We have an aging volunteer and donor base

5. NIMBYism can be a problem if allowed to take root and grow

OK, that's the doom and gloom. But any time of great change is also a time of great opportunity, and I see some advantages we now enjoy that we did not formerly:

1. With each passing decade America has grown more friendly to historic preservation. Years of advocacy by the National Trust and others have payed off. Just think how far we've come from the era of the demolition of Penn Station--every state now has a preservation office, there are preservation tax credits, TV shows on restorin gold houses rake in viewers, Civil War battle sites are preserved by trusts, and I could go on and on. We have a long way to go, but we have come a long way, too.

2. Heritage tourism is become more and more widely recognized as a vital economic and community redevelopment strategy. With this concept, we have a vocabulary that we can use to talk with politicaians, business leaders, civic planners, and other stakeholders in a language they can appreciate and understand--assuming we are smart enough to use it. We are not guys playing with trains, we are instead vital participants in the heritage-based recreation and tourism economy.

So what conclusions do I draw? Things are changing, and those changes create opportunities as well as threats. Models which were once very viable no longer work, and a new set of winners and losers will be created over the next 5-10 years.

Here are my predictions for who and what will thrive:

1. Organizations that pick one manageable, easy-to-understand mission and stick to it will do well. Good examples here are WK&S (as discussed below) and Ft. Collins (see my RyPN editorial) and WW&F. These groups have right-sized their physical plant and their collections to a size they can afford to maintain and operate in top-notch condition. They offer a quality experience at an affordable price, and the offer it consistently year-in and year-out.

2. Groups that forge alliances with local civic leaders will do well. Examples: someone noted to me me recently that WW&F officers take pains to attend every planning, zoning, and town leadership meeting in the area in which they operate. They have become known to the local powers that be, and have worked hard to assuage concerns and build alliances.

3. Groups that align themselve with larger heritage tourism/regional economic devleopment coalitions will do well. Look at what Mark Bassett is doing at Nevada Northern. Mark comes to NN from a background as a Main Street America community revitalization project manager. He speaks the lanaguage of heritage tourism and economic development, and he constantly advocates NN's historic value, but its present-day role in the economy of the community and the state it serves.

4. Groups that find creative ways to recruit and deploy human capital, especially volunteers, will do well. Gold star here to WW&F. This group has figured out a way for a small core group of local year-in and year-out volunteers to leverage periodic, intense labor contributions from a much larger national network of supporters to accomplish major capital projects in an amazingly short time. Read Wayne Laepelle's article on the WW&F tracklaying weekend if you haven't already. (Friends of Cumbres and Toltec also follows this model--maybe even pioneered it--but their larger situation is more complex. Friends of the EBT now follows it as well--but their larger situation is likewise more complex).

5. A handful of groups that have docked with major state or federal bureaucracies will be around for a long time to come. Embracing the government mothership is no panacea, it's not for everyone, and it carries its own risks, but nevertheless institutions which did not exist 30 years ago (CSRM, RRM of Pa, NCTM-Spencer) have carried off big projects and become a permanent and very welcome presence on the scene by embracing a "go big-go public" strategy. They will be leaders in our movement for some time to come.

That's the good news. Now, the bad news: here are my predicted losers in the new environment

1. Organizations which have functioned essentially as clubs with weak management and governance are not going to make it. Sooner or later, they will be eaten alive by the capital requirements of our business--sooner if the club members insist on hanging on to more stuff than they have any realistic hope of caring for. Note that I am not saying that volunteer governance doesn't work: it can work well, but only if it is backed up by a management and government structure which allows the group to function with a coherent mission, plan, and budget, and maintains accountability for results.

2. The NRHS chapter-mainline steam excusion plus montly meeting in the basement wing of our movement will soon be functionally extinct--gone, or evolved into something else.

3. The have-big-engine/will travel wing of our movement is going to be extinct, or winnowed to a handful of hyper-professional operations. A good example of who will survive is MSTRP/PM1223, which is fast morphing into a educational institution conducting outreach activities year-round out of a fixed base of operations, as opposed to a barnstorming locomotive operating group.

4. Any group that fails to actively recruit volunteers or new members, that makes it hard to join the in-group, that does not find ways to make use of a range of levels of skill levels and time availablity, or that tolerates hazing of the newbies (even mild) is on the road to extinction.

So, is your group a long-term survivor? If so, what positive trends are you relying on, and what are you doing to capitalize on them? How do you recruit and make use of new members? How are your relationships with civic and chamber of commerce and political and other leaders? Do you have a strategic plan? A collections plan that matches it? What are you doing that will ensure that you thrive? Tell us!

BlackRiver@nowhere.com

"most younger volunteers (defined as unedr 55 and having full-time employement) are interested in helping with a specific task, but do not want to commit to and extended period of service. i.e. the days of a regular weekly or monthly track crew are few and far between, but folks will respond to a call to come out for a periodic one-day blitz. "

--

I've tried the one day blitz with mixed results. The first day was weeding - went over fine. The next was painting and prep a coach - not one person. However, I'm going to try a new paint job one-day blitz on the Campo depot to see if that works.

Perhaps the solution is to agressively go after new members, from which we wind up with 10% active?

Jim

> I'm not currently involved with any museum,
> but I might suggest that museums with a
> little track and operable locomotives offer
> throttle time as an inducement to put in
> volunteer hours. Some accurate record of
> time worked would need to be kept, possibly
> with a time clock and volunteer employee
> time cards. Not sure how you'd handle those
> making retroactive claims for previous work,
> but it would seem an inducement for
> newcomers - so many hours of volunteer work
> for an hour in the seat. Has anyone tried
> this?

We've done this on the Heber Valley Railroad a number of times with our volunteer group, both with diesel and steam locomotives and limiting the operation to a short section of track within Yard Limits. A very good way to give someone "the bug" and keep them coming back, plus it also teaches them how the equipment works.

- Mike

Heber Valley Railroad
dakota97@xmission.com