Posted today on Trains Newswire at www.trains.com:

Soo Line 4-6-2 2719 bound for Montana

EAU CLAIRE, Wis. – Former Soo Line 4-6-2 2719, owned by the Locomotive & Tower Preservation Fund (L&TPF) of Eau Claire, will be heading west next month to its new home at the Talgo/Livingston Rebuild Center in Livingston, Mont., under a new 10-year lease to the non-profit 2719 Inc. of Portland, Ore.

The 1923 Alco had been returned to service in 1998 after being displayed in Eau ClaireÂ’s Carson Park since 1960 and hauled excursions on regional carrier Wisconsin Central. But with Canadian NationalÂ’s purchase of WC in October 2001, higher insurance premiums halted further excursions. The Pacific later steamed on Wisconsin Great Northern, a tourist-hauling short line at Spooner, Wis.

When the owning Eau Claire group, L&TPF, was notified by Union Pacific that the 4-6-2Â’s home, UPÂ’s former Chicago & North Western roundhouse in Altoona, Wis. (adjacent to Eau Claire), was scheduled for demolition starting this April, L&PTF was left in the position of having nowhere to run 2719 and no place to store it. (L&TPF is also responsible for the relocation of the C&NW Eau Claire interlocking tower to Carson Park as a display, hence the groupÂ’s name.)

Earlier this year, John Cox of Portland, Ore., formed 2719, Inc. with himself as president and Scott Lindsey of Steam Operations Corp. as a director. Cox is the former operations manager for the Pacific Railroad Preservation Assn., which operates ex-Spokane, Portland & Seattle 4-8-4 700. Ken Keeler, vice president of Rocky Mountain Rail Tours that runs luxury passenger excursions over Montana Rail Link, is also on the board. (In 2002, SP&S 700 steamed from its Portland home to make one series of excursions on MRL.) The group worked with regional development councils in Livingston and Butte, Mont., to obtain funding to bring the Soo Line locomotive west.

L&TPFÂ’s 10-year lease to 2719 Inc. stipulates that L&TPF is allowed to bring the engine back to the Midwest for possible future excursions, as long as those schedules do not conflict with the Montana operating schedule.

Preliminary plans call for the locomotive and tender to be moved west on flatcars, the engine to be converted from coal to an oil-burner, to retain its Soo Line identification for the present, and to operate on periodic excursions over Montana Rail Link, beginning in fall 2005. — Steve Glischinski

LNER4472-NOSPAM-@bcpl.net

> Posted today on Trains Newswire at
> www.trains.com:

> Soo Line 4-6-2 2719 bound for Montana

> EAU CLAIRE, Wis. – Former Soo Line 4-6-2
> 2719, owned by the Locomotive & Tower
> Preservation Fund (L&TPF) of Eau Claire,
> will be heading west next month to its new
> home at the Talgo/Livingston Rebuild Center
> in Livingston, Mont., under a new 10-year
> lease to the non-profit 2719 Inc. of
> Portland, Ore.

> The 1923 Alco had been returned to service
> in 1998 after being displayed in Eau
> ClaireÂ’s Carson Park since 1960 and hauled
> excursions on regional carrier Wisconsin
> Central. But with Canadian NationalÂ’s
> purchase of WC in October 2001, higher
> insurance premiums halted further
> excursions. The Pacific later steamed on
> Wisconsin Great Northern, a tourist-hauling
> short line at Spooner, Wis.

> When the owning Eau Claire group, L&TPF,
> was notified by Union Pacific that the
> 4-6-2Â’s home, UPÂ’s former Chicago &
> North Western roundhouse in Altoona, Wis.
> (adjacent to Eau Claire), was scheduled for
> demolition starting this April, L&PTF
> was left in the position of having nowhere
> to run 2719 and no place to store it.
> (L&TPF is also responsible for the
> relocation of the C&NW Eau Claire
> interlocking tower to Carson Park as a
> display, hence the groupÂ’s name.)

> Earlier this year, John Cox of Portland,
> Ore., formed 2719, Inc. with himself as
> president and Scott Lindsey of Steam
> Operations Corp. as a director. Cox is the
> former operations manager for the Pacific
> Railroad Preservation Assn., which operates
> ex-Spokane, Portland & Seattle 4-8-4
> 700. Ken Keeler, vice president of Rocky
> Mountain Rail Tours that runs luxury
> passenger excursions over Montana Rail Link,
> is also on the board. (In 2002, SP&S 700
> steamed from its Portland home to make one
> series of excursions on MRL.) The group
> worked with regional development councils in
> Livingston and Butte, Mont., to obtain
> funding to bring the Soo Line locomotive
> west.

> L&TPFÂ’s 10-year lease to 2719 Inc.
> stipulates that L&TPF is allowed to
> bring the engine back to the Midwest for
> possible future excursions, as long as those
> schedules do not conflict with the Montana
> operating schedule.

> Preliminary plans call for the locomotive
> and tender to be moved west on flatcars, the
> engine to be converted from coal to an
> oil-burner, to retain its Soo Line
> identification for the present, and to
> operate on periodic excursions over Montana
> Rail Link, beginning in fall 2005. — Steve
> Glischinski
Spelling correction needed! LINDSAY

dslsteamwizard@aol.com

Well, there are darn few finer places an engine could be sent off to. The Talgo shop is the former NP backshops and is equipped with sufficient major equipment for the heaviest of rebuilds. The shop has overhead cranes that could lift boilers from a 2-8-8-4 "Yellowstone".

With Montana Rail Link being steam friendly (witness the SP&S 700 excursion in 2002 and the SP 4449 excursion this October)and Montana Rockies Rail Tours having an outstanding working relationship with MRL, these developments are VERY interesting.

Michael Seitz
Missoula MT

> Posted today on Trains Newswire at
> www.trains.com:

> Soo Line 4-6-2 2719 bound for Montana

> EAU CLAIRE, Wis. – Former Soo Line 4-6-2
> 2719, owned by the Locomotive & Tower
> Preservation Fund (L&TPF) of Eau Claire,
> will be heading west next month to its new
> home at the Talgo/Livingston Rebuild Center
> in Livingston, Mont., under a new 10-year
> lease to the non-profit 2719 Inc. of
> Portland, Ore.

> The 1923 Alco had been returned to service
> in 1998 after being displayed in Eau
> ClaireÂ’s Carson Park since 1960 and hauled
> excursions on regional carrier Wisconsin
> Central. But with Canadian NationalÂ’s
> purchase of WC in October 2001, higher
> insurance premiums halted further
> excursions. The Pacific later steamed on
> Wisconsin Great Northern, a tourist-hauling
> short line at Spooner, Wis.

> When the owning Eau Claire group, L&TPF,
> was notified by Union Pacific that the
> 4-6-2Â’s home, UPÂ’s former Chicago &
> North Western roundhouse in Altoona, Wis.
> (adjacent to Eau Claire), was scheduled for
> demolition starting this April, L&PTF
> was left in the position of having nowhere
> to run 2719 and no place to store it.
> (L&TPF is also responsible for the
> relocation of the C&NW Eau Claire
> interlocking tower to Carson Park as a
> display, hence the groupÂ’s name.)

> Earlier this year, John Cox of Portland,
> Ore., formed 2719, Inc. with himself as
> president and Scott Lindsey of Steam
> Operations Corp. as a director. Cox is the
> former operations manager for the Pacific
> Railroad Preservation Assn., which operates
> ex-Spokane, Portland & Seattle 4-8-4
> 700. Ken Keeler, vice president of Rocky
> Mountain Rail Tours that runs luxury
> passenger excursions over Montana Rail Link,
> is also on the board. (In 2002, SP&S 700
> steamed from its Portland home to make one
> series of excursions on MRL.) The group
> worked with regional development councils in
> Livingston and Butte, Mont., to obtain
> funding to bring the Soo Line locomotive
> west.

> L&TPFÂ’s 10-year lease to 2719 Inc.
> stipulates that L&TPF is allowed to
> bring the engine back to the Midwest for
> possible future excursions, as long as those
> schedules do not conflict with the Montana
> operating schedule.

> Preliminary plans call for the locomotive
> and tender to be moved west on flatcars, the
> engine to be converted from coal to an
> oil-burner, to retain its Soo Line
> identification for the present, and to
> operate on periodic excursions over Montana
> Rail Link, beginning in fall 2005. — Steve
> Glischinski


Montana by Steam II
mikefrommontana@juno.com

> Well, there are darn few finer places an
> engine could be sent off to. The Talgo shop
> is the former NP backshops and is equipped
> with sufficient major equipment for the
> heaviest of rebuilds. The shop has overhead
> cranes that could lift boilers from a
> 2-8-8-4 "Yellowstone".

> With Montana Rail Link being steam friendly
> (witness the SP&S 700 excursion in 2002
> and the SP 4449 excursion this October)and
> Montana Rockies Rail Tours having an
> outstanding working relationship with MRL,
> these developments are VERY interesting.

> Michael Seitz
> Missoula MT

We'll miss her in the midwest but at least she'll be operating and in a good home. For those of you who have not seen this beauty, she has one of the sharpest exhausts around and she's a gutsy locomotive. Best of luck with the venture, fellows.

Don C.

http://www.261.com
milw261@sbcglobal.net

Three cheers for the owning group... that's too nice of an engine to sit and without a home base it had to go somewhere (my thought was possibly that Steamtown would be a good temporary port of call. Any group that's put a lot of money into an engine cannot afford to let it sit much while the 15 year clock is ticking. Even though it takes the engine out of their area, it preserves the operation. It takes a very mature group to do something like this.

I enjoyed seeing the engine in Osceola fresh out of the box in 1998 in the company of Soo 1003. In between feeding the mosquitoes, she made an impressive sight along the St. Croix. I also had the good fortune to ride and photograph her solo out of Ladysmith in 2001. She is one gutsy Pacific... now if someone will just explain to me why the Soo uglified the front end with the water pump...what were they thinking?

http://nctrans.org
Wrinnbo@aol.com

I understand the "nowhere to run" problem with the CN takeover of WC, but what is the big yank to destroy the Altoona roundhouse? UP has formerly been pretty benevolent about such things. Have the heartless lawyers taken over at UP also?


ryarger@rypn.org

No better display of good news versus bad news !

Good news is the engine has a new home and it seems a family amendable to operational duties.
Bad news it's so damn far from Chicago. Best of luck to all involved.

Anyways,I have a couple of questions, perhaps someone here has an answer or idea.

1)Why would the new operators have brought what is basically a midwest engine most of the way across the country, when the vastly under-used, and relatively regional SP&S #700 is essentially in their backyard ?
I assume there are reasons dealing with economies of operation, etc.

2) This seems like an ideal solution to a bad situation. One has to wonder why another fantastic engine sits collecting dust without an operational home, NMOT's Frisco 1522. Is there anything specific which prevents a similar situation allowing this engine to operate, or is it simply a lack of a good home and operating group (With suitably deep pockets of course)

3)I was always impressed with the number of steam operations in the 70's and 80's on the east coast, and of course Southern Rwy's late, great, lamented steam program. Always wondered why such a program never took hold here in the Chicago area, the "Rail Hub of America".
One would certainly think that an engine based in a major metropolitan area would be able to draw enough interest, and having it based in the Chicago area (for example) lends itself to many other tourist attractions as well.

Thoughts, comments, ideas ?

Thanks
John

FoxValley@aol.com

Bob, I have no first hand knowledge of the situation, but an inspection in 2001 showed a very old wooden building in bad condition across multiple tracks with no easy access by the public. Jim

http://nctrans.org
Wrinnbo@aol.com

Hello Jim and others,

I would be very interested in seeing any photos of the building that you have and other information (such as machine tools and their placement in the building, the layout of the building, etc.). I hope to announce something here soon.

Also, in regards to public access, while I have not been to the site personally - a reading of an aerial photo shows indicates that there are no tracks to the rear of the building with no barriers to a public park and boat launch about 150' yards away.

Many thanks,
Tom

> Bob, I have no first hand knowledge of the
> situation, but an inspection in 2001 showed
> a very old wooden building in bad condition
> across multiple tracks with no easy access
> by the public. Jim


rrhistorian@hotmail.com

Jim,

I second that and I hope it's a sign that the preservation movement in general seems to be "maturing" in that we see more and more museums rationalizing thier collections, making long term developing plans and swallowing thier pride and doing what's best for thier collection when they have no place to store or run as L&T.

I was also impressed in the late 1990s when a WC engine swideswiped 2719 on a siding overnight, not so long after its first restoration. Some people might have trown up thier hands and given up. But L&T rolled up thier sleeves and did what had to be done to put 2719 back on the road again.

It's a shame, the Altoona roundhouse is one of the few extant CNW roundhouses left and L&T looked to have grand plans for a museum complex there in the future, but as we all know, things don't always work out as planned.

I can also second the thought that Livingston is a great complex for 2719. I was there this summer and was impressed how much of the origional shops remained.



terry_dempsey@hotmail.com

The building is a dilapidated dump, in danger of collapsing on itself at any time. It is empty...no tools, machines or parts or anything else of interest or historical value.

At least UP gave them the chance to move it out of there before it ended up marooned. And UP is helping with the move behind the scenes, from what I hear.

> Hello Jim and others,

> I would be very interested in seeing any
> photos of the building that you have and
> other information (such as machine tools and
> their placement in the building, the layout
> of the building, etc.). I hope to announce
> something here soon.

> Also, in regards to public access, while I
> have not been to the site personally - a
> reading of an aerial photo shows indicates
> that there are no tracks to the rear of the
> building with no barriers to a public park
> and boat launch about 150' yards away.

> Many thanks,
> Tom

> 1)Why would the new operators have brought
> what is basically a midwest engine most of
> the way across the country, when the vastly
> under-used, and relatively regional SP&S
> #700 is essentially in their backyard ?
> I assume there are reasons dealing with
> economies of operation, etc.

IMO, It makes more sence to have a locomotive availible on line than paying and insuring a deadhead move once a year over a very buisy class 1 and to pay the dozen or so crew of said locomotive a couple of weeeks worth of wages. Because the locomotive will now be "on line", the length of the trains can be reduced as the operator now doesn't have to recover costs in one weeks time. The "on line" locomotive will also now be availible for use by the host railroad/ tour operator for community events year around.

If you want to see a 4-8-4 in Montana, my bet is this will be the last year to see it.

Smokebox

Just curious-why the conversion to oil? Is it for reasons of refueling practicality (i.e. easier to drive up a fuel truck vs. using a loader for coal), fear of cinders starting a fire, ease of service (no fire to clean/easier to fire up) or what? I admit that I far prefer coal-burning to oil for non-practical reasons (the engine's heritage, and coal smokes smells better) but was curious about this conversion.

> Just curious-why the conversion to oil? Is
> it for reasons of refueling practicality
> (i.e. easier to drive up a fuel truck vs.
> using a loader for coal), fear of cinders
> starting a fire, ease of service (no fire to
> clean/easier to fire up) or what?

Very short answers to above questions:
Yes
Yes
Yes
Plus the ability to kill the fire from several hours up to a day or so, depending upon how tight she is, and relighting with ease. Many benefits for the type of service engines are called upon for these days.

frisco1522@sbcglobal.net