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| Quarter mil for French Lick? https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9540 |
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| Author: | Frank Hicks [ Tue Apr 27, 2004 9:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Quarter mil for French Lick? |
A message board post (linked to below) claims that Donald Trump is building a casino resort of some sort in French Lick, Indiana and that he's given a grant for about $280,000 to the museum there. Has anyone else heard of this? My apologies if this has already been discussed. Frank Hicks http://talk.nycsubway.org/perl/read?subtalk=697806 F-Hicks@wiu.edu |
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| Author: | David M. Wilkins [ Tue Apr 27, 2004 10:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Quarter mil for French Lick? |
From what I've read and seen in the Louisville media, Trump's company is one of several potential bidders to build a riverboat casino in French Lick. Yes, yes, I know that French Lick is not located on or near any river, but they are going to build a big lagoon to put the riverboat casino in, thus in compliance with Indiana law. My assumption is the 250k grant for the museum is part of the proposal. Trump has enlisted Indiana native and professional golfer Fuzzy Zoeller to design the golf course. I think Larry Byrd and another group has a proposal in as well. david.wilkins@bardstown.com |
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| Author: | Dave K [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Quarter mil for French Lick? |
FWIW, Mr. Trump is said to be "broke" these days... From what I've read and seen in the > Louisville media, Trump's company is one of > several potential bidders to build a > riverboat casino in French Lick. Yes, yes, I > know that French Lick is not located on or > near any river, but they are going to build > a big lagoon to put the riverboat casino in, > thus in compliance with Indiana law. > My assumption is the 250k grant for the > museum is part of the proposal. Trump has > enlisted Indiana native and professional > golfer Fuzzy Zoeller to design the golf > course. I think Larry Byrd and another group > has a proposal in as well. newhaven0401-NOSPAM-@verizon.net |
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| Author: | Bob Kutella [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 5:35 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Quarter mil for French Lick? |
> FWIW, Mr. Trump is said to be > "broke" these days... I heard that story too. Nice to know his debt is bigger than my debt. But let's cross over to the disposable assets side. If we both had to liquidate our property, do you think the Donald would go hungry? Or would I be the one eating hotdogs and oatmeal? Come to think of it I already eat hotdogs and oatmeal! Bob Kutella 68trolley@comcast.net |
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| Author: | Don C. [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 7:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Quarter mil for French Lick? |
> I heard that story too. Nice to know his > debt is bigger than my debt. But let's cross > over to the disposable assets side. If we > both had to liquidate our property, do you > think the Donald would go hungry? Or would I > be the one eating hotdogs and oatmeal? Come > to think of it I already eat hotdogs and > oatmeal! > Bob Kutella What I would give to have a hotdog! Don C. http://www.261.com milw261@sbcglobal.net |
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| Author: | David M. Wilkins [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 9:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Quarter mil for French Lick? |
> FWIW, Mr. Trump is said to be > "broke" these days... From what I've read, Trump spun his casino empire off as a seperate corporation with investors. That isolated any losses he continued to get from his casino operations from harming his other business interests. Also, the "experts" say that Trump's real estate empire is heavily leveraged, and when interest rates climb up again, he'll go broke. How that would harm his casino corporation that he doesn't own controlling interest in, I don't know. david.wilkins@bardstown.com |
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| Author: | Jim Templin [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 9:35 am ] |
| Post subject: | The real issue............. |
is that casino style gambling destroys the "family tourism"that a tourist RR or museum relies on. The only folks who come out are the casinos; local restaraunts don't make any more because everybody eats in the casino, local attractions don't come out because gambling is a very "event spacific" activity. Gamblers go to gamble, and do nothing else. Even if they wanted to see the sights, and take in a tourist road or museum, if they have substantial casino wins, they wanna go home to keep them, if losses, they're mad and wanna go home cause they're broke. Non gambers just aren't interested in being anywhere near it. Look at what has happened to places like Cripple Creek and Central City. |
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| Author: | mw [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 10:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: The real issue............. |
> is that casino style gambling destroys the > "family tourism"that a tourist RR > or museum relies on. The only folks who come > out are the casinos; local restaraunts don't > make any more because everybody eats in the > casino, local attractions don't come out > because gambling is a very "event > spacific" activity. Gamblers go to > gamble, and do nothing else. I visited Atlantic City, NJ a few years ago. The casinos were very impressive operations and no doubt provide jobs and add to the local tax base. But it was obvious the economic benefits had not spread to even the surrounding neighborhoods, much less the rest of the city, which was,to put it mildly, a bit on the "dowdy" side. That was about ten years ago and from what I've heard, things haven't changed much. mw p_michael_warren@yahoo.com |
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| Author: | jd johnson [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 11:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Quarter mil for French Lick? |
> Does this meand Frnchlick will have steam again any time soon. Old 97 needs a lot of work to run again. Not sure about 208. Thanks. jd johnson mnfrailhist@hotmail.com |
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| Author: | George Jenista [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | French Lick steam |
> Does this meand Frenchlick will have steam again any time soon. Old 97 needs a lot of work to run again. Not sure about 208. __ The lease on #208 having run out, it is expected that planning will commence at some point to return it to Texas. hi_plain@yahoo.com |
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| Author: | L Beckman [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 2:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: French Lick steam |
> __ > The lease on #208 having run out, it is > expected that planning will commence at some > point to return it to Texas. George: As a point, did IRM ever use the 208? And if so, for how much of her lease was she under steam? Les Beckman (HVRM) midlandblb@cs.com |
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| Author: | jd johnson [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 2:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: French Lick steam |
> #208 was operated for a time back in 1986-87. I had the pleasure of working as student firemen on her at that time. There were some dedicated folks from Whitewater Valley that also worked on her and ran her. jd Johnson mnfrailhist@hotmail.com |
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| Author: | George Jenista [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 3:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: French Lick steam |
> As a point, did IRM ever use the 208? And if > so, for how much of her lease was she under > steam? My understanding is that she operated into the 90's. The lease expired after 1996. She has lain in repose at French Lick since then. hi_plain@yahoo.com |
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| Author: | Rob Davis [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 5:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Or... Re: The real issue............. |
Jim, I just got back from a week in Vegas on business. There are some interesting developments that may challenge your assumption. The casinos in Vegas are actively trying to debiliate the girlie bars' business, and for two reasons. One, strip clubs take gamblers away from the tables. Secondly, the casinos are actively trying to promote Vegas and a gambling trip as family entertainment. They don't want girlie shows to be the most obviousl non-gambling pasttime. Gambling and tourism are a going concern in Vegas. Certainly, the rail museum in Boulder City benefits from both casinos and the Hoover Dam. Done well, the two can co-exist. Of course, there are more examples of bad development than good. Atlantic City is a classic example of casinos not doing a blasted thing for anything or anyone who doesn't happen to own one. But I wouldn't write off the French Lick plan as not having a potential upside for a tourist railroad, especially if there is an influx of cash. I guess the question is, what will put more butts in seats... French Lick as it is now, or French Lick with gambling? Crystal ball, please... Rob > is that casino style gambling destroys the > "family tourism"that a tourist RR > or museum relies on. The only folks who come > out are the casinos; local restaraunts don't > make any more because everybody eats in the > casino, local attractions don't come out > because gambling is a very "event > spacific" activity. Gamblers go to > gamble, and do nothing else. Even if they > wanted to see the sights, and take in a > tourist road or museum, if they have > substantial casino wins, they wanna go home > to keep them, if losses, they're mad and > wanna go home cause they're broke. Non > gambers just aren't interested in being > anywhere near it. > Look at what has happened to places like > Cripple Creek and Central City. |
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| Author: | L Beckman [ Wed Apr 28, 2004 6:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Or... Re: The real issue............. |
> Jim, > I just got back from a week in Vegas on > business. There are some interesting > developments that may challenge your > assumption. > The casinos in Vegas are actively trying to > debiliate the girlie bars' business, and for > two reasons. One, strip clubs take gamblers > away from the tables. Secondly, the casinos > are actively trying to promote Vegas and a > gambling trip as family entertainment. They > don't want girlie shows to be the most > obviousl non-gambling pasttime. > Gambling and tourism are a going concern in > Vegas. Certainly, the rail museum in Boulder > City benefits from both casinos and the > Hoover Dam. > Done well, the two can co-exist. > Of course, there are more examples of bad > development than good. Atlantic City is a > classic example of casinos not doing a > blasted thing for anything or anyone who > doesn't happen to own one. > But I wouldn't write off the French Lick > plan as not having a potential upside for a > tourist railroad, especially if there is an > influx of cash. > I guess the question is, what will put more > butts in seats... French Lick as it is now, > or French Lick with gambling? Crystal ball, > please... > Rob Rob: The first thing to remember is that "The Donald" is offering a grant to the Indiana Railway Museum to help him in his effort to acquire this particular casino license. Would it help put more butts in the seats? Probably not very much. BUT, would it help Indiana Railroad Museum? Sure it would. And depending on how IRM spends the money, it may well increase their patronage. As stated previously, there is no doubt that the majority of gamblers would come to gamble, not eat at local restaurants, visit local sites or ride the local tourist train. But the income from gambling revenues would help the local economy and provide jobs to local people. Folks that come to ride the tourist train would still come and hopefully, IRM would be able to attract more of these people by using the monies from Trump, if he is successful in getting the license. So perhaps the question should be, would IRM rather have the money or not have the money? I can't speak for them. But I think I could give a pretty good guess as to their answer. Les Beckman (Hoosier Valley Railroad Museum) midlandblb@cs.com |
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