Now here is an interesting development in the rails vs. trails debate:

A Wichita land trust is actually pushing for the rail line's retention!

This is one to watch, and SUPPORT!


Old track, new trolley
jgerlach@trainsofthought.com

> Now here is an interesting development in
> the rails vs. trails debate:

> A Wichita land trust is actually pushing for
> the rail line's retention!

> This is one to watch, and SUPPORT!

I just e-mailed the reporter that wrote the article. She states at the bottom of the article BNSF wants to pull all the track & has told the city it's cheaper to let them pull all the track & have the land trust relay it all with light rail for street cars. If that happens & the rail is pulled you can bet it'll be a trail for sure no matter what. Wooly

wooly421@charter.net

Absolutely on target there, Wooly!

Harvesting the track would spell doom for any kind rail use short of a full-scale light rail project, and though I have never been to Wichita, I'd say that scenario is extremely remote.

The photo acompanying the article shows a reasonably intact track structure, with the same "light rail" that the BNSF spokesman claims is "much, much cheaper to maintain" -- already in place! An Edwards Motor Car line, maybe?

Bravo to you, Wooly, for writing the reporter. Someone with more local knowledge than I might want to write to the Sunflower Land Trust, and explain that their "trolley" proposal is DOA without the Frisco tracks intact.

Here's another limited-time opportunity that we railway preservationists need to move on, NOW!

> I just e-mailed the reporter that wrote the
> article. She states at the bottom of the
> article BNSF wants to pull all the track
> & has told the city it's cheaper to let
> them pull all the track & have the land
> trust relay it all with light rail for
> street cars. If that happens & the rail
> is pulled you can bet it'll be a trail for
> sure no matter what. Wooly


jgerlach@trainsofthought.com

> Absolutely on target there, Wooly!

> Harvesting the track would spell doom for
> any kind rail use short of a full-scale
> light rail project, and though I have never
> been to Wichita, I'd say that scenario is
> extremely remote.

> The photo acompanying the article shows a
> reasonably intact track structure, with the
> same "light rail" that the BNSF
> spokesman claims is "much, much cheaper
> to maintain" -- already in place! An
> Edwards Motor Car line, maybe?

> Bravo to you, Wooly, for writing the
> reporter. Someone with more local knowledge
> than I might want to write to the Sunflower
> Land Trust, and explain that their
> "trolley" proposal is DOA without
> the Frisco tracks intact.

> Here's another limited-time opportunity that
> we railway preservationists need to move on,
> NOW!

Jeff: Thanks for the idea I just mailed the reporter back & asked for her help in getting me in touch with Sunflower Land Trust. Also if anybody is local to Wicita on here perhaps they could get in touch with Great Plains Transportation Museum in Wichita. They have theAT&SF 4-8-4 # 3768, maybe they would want to get involved at a local level. I live in Nebraska so don't really know the local lay of the land. Wooly

wooly421@charter.net

Here's a link to the contact info page at the Sunflower Land Trust Web site (see below).

I'll send a message when I get a chance, as well.

I encourage anyone with insight and experience in negotiating such a project to contribute a line or two.

It would be great to develop a model for other "trails" conservation organizations to follow to keep the tracks intact, as they work to preserve irreplaceable corridors.

> Jeff: Thanks for the idea I just mailed the
> reporter back & asked for her help in
> getting me in touch with Sunflower Land
> Trust. Also if anybody is local to Wicita on
> here perhaps they could get in touch with
> Great Plains Transportation Museum in
> Wichita. They have theAT&SF 4-8-4 #
> 3768, maybe they would want to get involved
> at a local level. I live in Nebraska so
> don't really know the local lay of the land.
> Wooly


http://www.sunflowerlandtrust.com/sfhowtoreachus.htm
jgerlach@trainsofthought.com

I will send them E-mail. The reporter for the paper mailed me back & thanked me for my mail & gave me the phone # for the CEO of the trust Wooly

> Here's a link to the contact info page at
> the Sunflower Land Trust Web site (see
> below).

> I'll send a message when I get a chance, as
> well.

> I encourage anyone with insight and
> experience in negotiating such a project to
> contribute a line or two.

> It would be great to develop a model for
> other "trails" conservation
> organizations to follow to keep the tracks
> intact, as they work to preserve
> irreplaceable corridors.


wooly421@charter.net

I have e-mailed the sunflower land trust At the link below & gave some prior case histories & so on & urge others to do so so as to at least get the rail to be left in place until a decision is made. With no rail there the decision is pretty easy. Another trail. I urge others to do the same. Wooly

> Here's a link to the contact info page at
> the Sunflower Land Trust Web site (see
> below).

> I'll send a message when I get a chance, as
> well.

> I encourage anyone with insight and
> experience in negotiating such a project to
> contribute a line or two.

> It would be great to develop a model for
> other "trails" conservation
> organizations to follow to keep the tracks
> intact, as they work to preserve
> irreplaceable corridors.


wooly421@charter.net

Sunflower Land Trust
wooly421@charter.net

There may also be some help from the following group linked below, if you know any local speeder guys.



Rail Preservation for speeder use
cvitz@hotmail.com

This track has been looked at for the past ten years as a possible tourist line by several groups both with and without money behind them. It is a noble idea but if you saw the number of grade crossings that need to be maintained and the level at which they need renewed with updated signals you would understand why no one has come forward to fund the project. I am on the board for the local museum and we do not have the means to undertake a project like this. The data that is out there indicates the line would have to receive large subsidies from the local govt's and that is unlikly with the lack of funds from a lower tax base in this area.

johndeck@cox.net

John: Are you with Great Plains Transportation Museum???// Wooly

> This track has been looked at for the past
> ten years as a possible tourist line by
> several groups both with and without money
> behind them. It is a noble idea but if you
> saw the number of grade crossings that need
> to be maintained and the level at which they
> need renewed with updated signals you would
> understand why no one has come forward to
> fund the project. I am on the board for the
> local museum and we do not have the means to
> undertake a project like this. The data that
> is out there indicates the line would have
> to receive large subsidies from the local
> govt's and that is unlikly with the lack of
> funds from a lower tax base in this area.


wooly421@charter.net

I was off for a few days, government meetings in Atlanta...plus two very enjoyable rides on the Silver Comet Rail Trail. (My trusty steed -- "Mr. Canondale" -- did have a "mechanical" which was fixed by one of 18 people who work either full- or part-time at the Silver Comet Bike Shop in Dallas. Now, there's a statistic for the benefit:cost analyses about which I am sure local rail-trail proponents track constantly.)

Anyway, I saw something worth reporting here -- the trail was packed on both Wednesday and Thursday afternoons and evenings. While I did not take an accurate count, on Thursday I would bet I passed more than 500 individual trail users in the course of traveling 22 miles. And that was a weekday afternoon.

I was told the tralhead parking lots in Cobb and Paulding counties are packed on weekends. Even in the Winter, weekends reportedly are busy.

While these findings are purely anecdotal not scientific, and goodness knows I like research, it is instructive in the following regard:

In addition to a policy problem, I think railroad preservation has got a marketing problem it needs to concurrently address. And soon.

Add this to the list of concerns for those of us dedicated to historical railroad preservation. That list includes membership retention and replacement, projection selection and completion, and many other subjects about which there has been considerable well-reasoned discussion here on RYPN.

I hope these thoughtful discussions continue. RYPN contributors are making considerable efforts to share their thoughts, experiences, and opinions. RYPN is very valuable board. My thanks to its Moderators and organizers. I am learning a lot, and finding that there are many more aspects to this rail preservation policy issues than I ever imagined.

amiller@rtms-movietrains.com

John,

I appeciate the difficulties involved for any volunteer-based organization to put forward a viable railroad preservation plan to counter a pending track removal. No doubt your group has spent much time and effort in examining these options over the years before concluding, apparently, that this project was beyond your resources.

Nevertherless, it is encouraging that both a "trails group" (the Sunflower Land Trust), two city council members, a state senator and the local paper (see link) are supportive of exploring alternatives to the usual "scrap and pave" scenario.

As railway preservationists, we ALL have a big job ahead in developing viable 'Community Railroad' model(s).

But it seems from here at least, (admittedly far-away NYC,) you might just have more allies than you thought in Wichita.

Best regards,

Jeff Gerlach

> This track has been looked at for the past
> ten years as a possible tourist line by
> several groups both with and without money
> behind them. It is a noble idea but if you
> saw the number of grade crossings that need
> to be maintained and the level at which they
> need renewed with updated signals you would
> understand why no one has come forward to
> fund the project. I am on the board for the
> local museum and we do not have the means to
> undertake a project like this. The data that
> is out there indicates the line would have
> to receive large subsidies from the local
> govt's and that is unlikly with the lack of
> funds from a lower tax base in this area.


Wichita Eagle Editorial: On Track
jgerlach@trainsofthought.com

> This track has been looked at for the past
> ten years as a possible tourist line by
> several groups both with and without money
> behind them. It is a noble idea but if you
> saw the number of grade crossings that need
> to be maintained and the level at which they
> need renewed with updated signals you would
> understand why no one has come forward to
> fund the project. I am on the board for the
> local museum and we do not have the means to
> undertake a project like this. The data that
> is out there indicates the line would have
> to receive large subsidies from the local
> govt's and that is unlikly with the lack of
> funds from a lower tax base in this area.
I have been asked by the CEO of the Sunflower Land Trust if I could give him a reliable estimate Or put him in touch with some one who could for an estimate on the cost to lay 11 miles of street car rail. Can anyone help me please WOOLY

wooly421@charter.net