Anthracite road fans, don't let #952 blind ye as there is a Lehigh Valley coach on this list!

i have just finished editing two posts that had the potential of kicking off a flame war re DL&W 952. I left the facts of the matter alone.

All of you are on notice. This thread is being watched. I do not want to lock it.

Ooooooohhhh, you're in trouble now! You dare speak of one of the unofficial banned subjects on RYPN...

That Italian locomotive is quite interesting, especially the divided pans for collecting three phase power. I suppose the third leg was fed via the rails? With the devaluation of the US dollar and a more close knit group of rail enthusiasts in Italy that locomotive may just find its way back home. I wish them luck.

I have not been to St. Louis, but many of the pictures in the PDF show additional atored equipment that is not on the list. Just how much stuff do they have and what percentage is stored unrestored vs. restored and on display?

Oh, those subjects aren't banned, per se. They just have the propensity to descend inevitably towards circular name-calling fests and attempts to reach towards Godwin's Law........ <:-]

[proudly polishing my "1361" belt buckle once again....... must be coming time for another RyPN Interchange Regulars Gathering........ maybe for 2009, we meet up at American Freedom Train 1 in Baltimore? Or maybe SP&S 539 at the Grand Canyon RR? Or the Mexican 4-8-4, VBR 9, and CN 1533 at New Hope?.......]

Don't forget 2100!

Im sorry I said anything about 952, I didnt know the previous problems you had discussing it.

As a vollunteer at the Museum of Transport, it does sadden me to see the Museum unloading some artifacts. On the other hand, I have to agree with the decision to go ahead with removing equipment that will not be restored in my lifetime. Some of the equipment being put up for adoption, was in good shape when it arrived. Time has been a real enemy to the artifacts. Hopefully the equipment can go someplace and be put to use as a whole item. Unfortunately, some of the equipment may be stripped for parts and the rest of it scrapped. I guess that even "parts" is better than nothing.
On the other hand, we have made great strides in preserving what we have over the last 10, 15 years. The great problem of not enough money and people has always been our choke points. But we plod on. Vollunteers are always needed. Money, well that is harder to come by.
My latest project is the Missouri Pacific Eagle observation car #750. I hope to finish the car this year. I have some very good volunteers working with me on this project. I just explain what is needed, and then get out of their way.

You know, Mr Mitchell, you have an idea here. We could get together for a reunion and then settle some of the ancient RyPN feuds the old way ... May I propose a jousting tournament at Groffs Grove on Amish draft horses, or perhaps pistols at twenty paces? Ponderous "ideas-have-consequences" Dave, or maybe the Engineering Standards Committee could be the judges ...

According to the Pictorial History of Electric Locomotives by Haut this locomotive weighs 60.2 metric tons in working order. Other useful dimensions are: total length (buffer to buffer) - 9,500 mm, and total wheelbase - 6,120 mm. The book has a cut-away drawing of the locomotive on page 80 with additional dimensions.

I admit to having put on a few pounds since my teen years, but I don't think 178 lbs is exactly ponderous for a 5'10" height. And I never was graceful even when I was young and skinny.........

Better include me out of this one. Yeah, I have let that quote hang in there way too long. I'll see what turns up that sounds promising.

dave

It would be nice to see a museum (any museum) recognize the value of an E8 or E9 as a "visible" display locomotive. Photos of the glass sided cutaway E-unit at the 1939-1940 Worlds Fair demonstrate the tremendous display potential of this kind of locomotive, it is hard to find a photo where the view of the locomotive is not obstructed by dozens of visitors looking into the locomotive at the machinery through the glass side panels. That showing was done in times very much like today, 1939 was not a particularly good time for the international situations or the economy.

PC

Regarding the Italian locomotive--60 metric tons is not much more than a Sacramento Northern or Pacific Electric interurban freight locomotive, so we're not talking about something in the GG1 range. On the other hand, I think the Italians, and (as I recall) the Great Northern here in the US found 3-phase overhead to be (using proper engineering terminology) a royal pain in actual service. One curious aspect of 3-phase operation, especially 16.667 Hz 3-phase was the use of 3-phase light bulbs. This subject came up at an informal gathering of electric railway fans, and was considered by some to be in the same league as "20 feet of flight line" or a "set of spark plugs for a Cummins NH220". Turns out there really was such a device, specifically designed to deal with the flicker of a lamp running on low-frequency AC. It had three filaments, and presumably a base similar to a common 3-way light bulb or else something like a combination taillight/stoplight bulb for US autos.

Don't be sad. They're going to a better place. Literally! Many times, I've seen a long-neglected piece arrive at a new museum, and be placed at the top of the priority list for restoration. North Shore 761, SN 1632, etc.

MoT absolutely should be commended for making the decision to deaccession. This is a very courageous decision for any museum to make - often very politically divisive. The easier thing by far is to forever delay and defer the decision, while the pieces rot beyond hope.



We all struggle to get equipment indoors. Having a strong collections policy helps that; otherwise you can fall into a logical trap. Clearly it's cheaper to deaccession than cover a piece, right? The temptation is to not build barns for the equipment you hope to deaccession - meanwhile the deaccession never gets done and the equipment just deteriorates. I say cover everything. Worst case you'll have too much carbarn space. Such a problem to have!

Deaccessioning can be a win-win situation. I can think of two electric railway cars that were rather low on the priority list at one museum, and were sold off to help house and preserve cars that were closer to the "mission statement". One is running in its home city and the other is enjoying "only child" status at a museum near its "home road", where its restoration is proceeding well.
Sometimes, when I see terms like deaccession and mission statement, I think of when I got involved with railway preservation 45 years ago, and how such terminology would be a foreign language in those day.

I am convinced that railway museums have a "maturity process" they go through. A railway museum that "hits the ground running" with AAM certification, best practices etc. is practically unheard of.

I think the vast majority of rail museums start with railfans collecting artifacts. This causes them a series of problems. They don't really foresee problems (much) or make backup plans. Often they're an eviction notice away from another problem! What we know about the museums that have lasted is they set down roots. Acquire a railroad and land, and start building storage tracks. When would you say that tends to happen? My guess is around the 20 year mark or longer. Then years go by before the next evolution - barns, for instance, or decent visitor facilities. Hell bathrooms, anyone? :)

Can you think of a museum that doesn't own their own facility? That depends on largesse that could end in the future?

It would seem to take a good 40-60 years for a museum to get to where IRM, Branford, Seashore, OERM, Rio Vista are. You know any young, great museums? I can't think of any, outside those that are wards of a government entity (like VMT, CSRM, Steamtown etc.) Can you?