It is currently Sat Jun 21, 2025 3:17 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 73 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 12:42 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
Posts: 2226
The Sparrows site is known for making steam engines for the ships, I agree thats a stern or bow or whatever in the background near the crane, the crane close enough to construct around the ship. The antenna looks like one of them magnet mounts, so the engine had to still be active even at this late date, working as a local shunter for the yard, that had to be the story how the engine was used as its not showing on the railroad rosters. There may not have been fireless cookers there, the engine could have also been used to supply steam for whatever was needed which may explain all the hoses, there was still a lot of steam in use on ships despite the railroads giving up so it seems the 0-6-0 was still valuable. It seems this track is stub ended and there are these hoses there to pick steam up, there may have been more stub tracks like this for this engine to park and supply steam.

Sparrows point yard is no more as it was then. The yard was used to scrap some ships so they were certainly capable to scrap anything, whether this engine met that fate is the work in progress here.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 1:30 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
Posts: 2226
perhaps the thing to do here is to find this book

The Patapsco and Back Rivers Railroad: Chronicles of the Push, Bump, and Ram

as the author was allowed to wander the line freely and it ran into Sparrows point , a hard to publicly get to place, why we may have heard little about this place.

This one pic may be just a drop in the bucket what was happening at Sparrows.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 8:00 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 11847
Location: Somewhere east of Prescott, AZ along the old Santa Fe "Prescott & Eastern"
Well, no [BLEEP], Sherlock.

The initial press run sold out literally before I could buy a copy. There was supposed to be a second printing, but so far it hasn't happened. And I'm not paying inflated mark-ups for it. Fortunately, we have two copies at the Md. Rail Heritage Library at the Baltimore Streetcar Museum.

I couldn't get there when they were open yesterday (if indeed they even bothered to open); I will have to wait until Wednesday at the earliest.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 8:40 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
Posts: 2226
http://www.wsbcos.com/pbr/pbr.htm

this has a roster of the Patapsco & Back Rivers, it includes an 0-6-0 #1 with more info

#1


class 6-36-D, 231


baldwin builders number 44,130


0-6-0


the author may not have recognized if it was a tank or not, the disposition is blank so may have been still in operation at that time.

It says they gave up on steam 46-47, but may not mean engines around the plant.

there's a listing of all the tracks, imagine trying to model all of this, that is HUGE!


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:02 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 11847
Location: Somewhere east of Prescott, AZ along the old Santa Fe "Prescott & Eastern"
I'll wager you all the money I have right now that all the 0-6-0s mentioned are tender locos.

Again, it is the very fact that the loco in the original photo is anomalous on several points that make me skeptical that this is Beth Steel. If this were a tender 0-6-0, it would make sense. If it were allegedly taken in the 1940s, fine. But not an 0-6-0T supposedly in the 1960s around a railroad and plant that was quite early to dieselize.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 10:01 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:25 pm
Posts: 2472
Location: The Atlantic Coast Line
Might this be a photoshopped "mystery?" There is a blur on the side of the cylinder and the CB antenna could be easily added.

Wesley


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 11:14 am 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 6471
dinwitty wrote:
the engine could have also been used to supply steam for whatever was needed which may explain all the hoses, there was still a lot of steam in use on ships despite the railroads giving up so it seems the 0-6-0 was still valuable.


dinwitty -

I think you may well have hit on the explanation of why the saddletanker was still around. All that hose has to mean something, and there appears to be some type of a piece of metal sticking out horizontally from the crosshead, seeming to indicate that the engine wasn't moved much, if at all. The idea being that this piece would be a place to wrap the hose, except of course, whoever used it found it easier to just throw it wherever (including on the pilot) than to actually wrap it up. Perhaps someone can blow up that portion of the photo to get a closer look at just exactly what that piece was. This might also explain why this particular 0-6-0T. Regular steam (perhaps from the P&BR) had been used, but dieselization ended that availability so the shipyard (or whatever) needed to find another source. A local scrapyard had this old 0-6-0T turned in for cutting up, and it offered the company a relatively cheap alternative. Anyway, one possibility.

Les


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 11:55 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:25 pm
Posts: 2472
Location: The Atlantic Coast Line
Here is an enlargement of the area of the cylinder and crosshead. The cylinder area looks photo-shopped to remove details. Perhaps better eyes can discern what the fittings are for?

Wesley

Image


Last edited by wesp on Mon Jan 19, 2015 6:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 12:39 pm 

Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2014 6:26 am
Posts: 60
In the early 1980s I worked in the communications dept of a large utility company.The antenna type shown is not limited to CB. Mobile (car and truck) antennas of this type were made for frequencies from 27 to 174 Mhz with the difference being the internal wiring of the coil inside the plastic base. That frequency range covers a wide variety of users besides CB including at that time a large percentage of the businesses using two way radio and most railroads.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 8:30 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
Posts: 2226
it looks like the cylinders have been drilled into and connections made to get steam thru the cylinders. That way you can control the steam using the throttle. If you had to move the engine you could just plug those holes. Put the engine in neutral. Or just barely notch the throttle to let steam thru. I'm just thinking in neutral if any steam is allowed to pass to the cylinders. Right now its hard to tell about photoshopping.

The borrowing of a steamer from a scrapper makes a lot of sense to me, if the railroad decided to drop steam, the shipyard still needed the steam generation so scrambled for anything. The engine looks weatherworn but that tank sure looks fresh like they did a swap.

It really doesnt make sense to drill into the cylinders for steam when there should be other ways to get the steam, note the piping hanging on the rear. But it seems to be a way to get a controlled steam for a certain application need.

Altho I would still keep hopes up, I would just about assume this engine had to had gotten scrapped.

I think finding that book is a gold mine.

Any books on Vulcan builder rosters?

This engine is not new by any means as its inside valves which really dates it.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:54 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:10 pm
Posts: 1182
It's obvious to me this locomotive has not moved in some time. Which leads me to think it may have been used as a steam supply for a variety of tasks, such as steaming out fuel tanks, blowing out steam lines and steam cleaning vessels which may have stopped by what might be a ship repair facility. That might explain the various hoses visible in the photo.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 10:28 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:16 pm
Posts: 227
If it was a stationary steam supply, where would the most likely point be that they'd take steam from. On top of the steam dome? I don't see much action up there.. but it may be out of sight.
Looks like the bigger hose on this side is seen snaking along on the ground on the front of the engine... then disappearing back towards the engine behind the rail.

Also, look at the short piece of steel H-beam laying there on the ground in the foreground? Look on the ground there behind it on the near end.

That looks like a globe valve.... with a hose hooked to it.. and that may be the hose which snakes along and around to the other side.

That may be the feedwater for the boiler... with a shutoff valve.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 10:45 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 11847
Location: Somewhere east of Prescott, AZ along the old Santa Fe "Prescott & Eastern"
wesp wrote:
Here is an enlargement of the area of the cylinder and crosshead. The cylinder area looks photo-shopped to remove details. Perhaps better eyes can discern what the fittings are for?

I'm looking at this with eyes trained by two generations of photo work on both parents' sides, and what I'm seeing is a jury-rigged "hose rack" with welded brackets sitting between the loco and the photographer, several feet in front of the side of the loco, and NOT attached directly to the loco itself, let alone to the side rods, cylinder, etc. The right end of this inverted-U-shaped stand is at least a driver's diameter away from the loco, perhaps two--three to six feet, in other words. And everyone but me assumes the clutter on the left of the photo is hung on the corner of the loco; again, I see a shift in the depth of field/focus, which indicates a distance between the hoses in question and the object behind it.


Last edited by Alexander D. Mitchell IV on Wed Jan 21, 2015 10:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 11:05 pm 

Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2006 5:19 pm
Posts: 594
Location: Bowie, MD
FYI, the photo is fill flashed. Note how you can see detail in the bell and the hose shadows against the loki. That may account for some of the confusion in the depth perspective.

Bob


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Mystery Steam Loco Pic of the Month
PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2015 11:58 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 11847
Location: Somewhere east of Prescott, AZ along the old Santa Fe "Prescott & Eastern"
Before we go too far on photo analysis, here's a "before and after" comparison provided on Facebook by the original poster:
Attachment:
BethSteel1BeforeAfter.jpg
BethSteel1BeforeAfter.jpg [ 65.74 KiB | Viewed 8309 times ]


Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 73 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


 Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 122 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: