We have BEDT 0-6-0T 12 at the Florida Gulf Coast RR Museum. This engine was built by Porter in 1919 for the Brooklyn Navy Yard and later ran on BEDT with it's identical sister, no. 13. The 13 is now at the RR Museum of PA at Srasburg.

We have a few photos of the 12 on BEDT but none from it's days at the navy yard. Can anyone steer me toward a source for a photo of either engine at the navy yard? Any help will be appreciated.

Thanks
Jim Herron

hrvideo@mindspring.com

Jim,

I would be interested if you find any sources for BNY photos since we do not have any in service pics of our BNY steamer, BNY #12(0-4-0T Vulcan 1918). This engine is owned by the Rochester & Genesee Valley Railroad Museum and is currently torn down for evaluation for rebuild. More info can be found on our website at the link below.

One other quick question, was your engine renumbered to #12 when it went to the BEDT or did BNY have two #12's? Or am I lacking something in my understanding of the history of our engine?

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks!

Until later,
Chris


BNY#12 at the R&GV Railroad Museum

crhauf@frontiernet.net

I too am a bit confused. Here is a photo of BEDT #13 in service in 1959. My dad was in the Navy in the 1950's, but I have yet to find any pics from the BNY.



SJHussar@aol.com

> Jim,

> I would be interested if you find any
> sources for BNY photos since we do not have
> any in service pics of our BNY steamer, BNY
> #12(0-4-0T Vulcan 1918). This engine is
> owned by the Rochester & Genesee Valley
> Railroad Museum and is currently torn down
> for evaluation for rebuild. More info can be
> found on our website at the link below.

> One other quick question, was your engine
> renumbered to #12 when it went to the BEDT
> or did BNY have two #12's? Or am I lacking
> something in my understanding of the history
> of our engine?

> Any help would be appreciated.

> Thanks!

> Until later,
> Chris
Dear Chris in approx. 1960 I went to bedt and took some pix. I think they were 35mm. If this will do I will try to find them. btw the new locos built for bedt had 1 3/4" tubes for burning hard coal. The used one have the more popular 2" size. Which does yours have? regards bb

staybolt2@netscape.net

bb,

I am not really sure. I was not directly involved in the removal of the flues, so I do not know off hand. I will find out one of two ways. If I see one of our steam guys, I am sure they can tell me or a simple measurement of one of them in the dead flue pile should give me an answer. Some of the other members of this group might be able to help as I know some of them have restored Vulcan's very similar to ours. According to the history compiled by us, our #12 received a new boiler in 1931 so that may change from as built size as well. Plus, our loco was built for new for BNY and not BEDT.

As for your 1960 photos, our #12 was long gone from Brooklyn by then and was on the Dexter & Northern up in the Adirondacks. However, they may be of use to Mr. Herron.

Thanks for the offer though and I will let you know the flue size.

Until later,
Chris

P.S. Added another photo below from our website of #12 being loaded for shipment to our museum.

> Dear Chris in approx. 1960 I went to bedt
> and took some pix. I think they were 35mm.
> If this will do I will try to find them. btw
> the new locos built for bedt had 1 3/4"
> tubes for burning hard coal. The used one
> have the more popular 2" size. Which
> does yours have? regards bb


BNY#12 at the R&GV Railroad Museum

crhauf@frontiernet.net

Thanks to you all!

I don't have the history of our no. 12 except that we have heard that both the 12 and 13 came from BNY. These two are identical engines with side tanks as shown in the pic posted by Steve.

I suspect that our no 12 was the first at BNY and was replaced by the 0-4-0T after the 12 and 13 were sold to BEDT. We would like to find the sales date as well.

We would be interested in photos of the 12 on BEDT as well as BNY.

By the way, the BNY 12 0-4-0T looks great!

-Jim Herron

hrvideo@mindspring.com

Ok well we cannot forget the last steam locomotive to operate for its railroad on the east coast of the United States of Amerca BEDT 16 0-6-0t #16 at the Railroad Museum OfLong Island, and BEDT 15 aka Thomas the Tank @ Strausburg RR. So lets not forget about numbe 16.

http://RMLI.org
BEDT15@aol.com

I hate to ask the obvious, but has anyone tried the US Navy in their search for photos of these locos? I would be amazed if there weren't some filed away somewhere.


Museum of Transportation
rdgoldfede@aol.com

> I hate to ask the obvious, but has anyone
> tried the US Navy in their search for photos
> of these locos?

That's true, the Navy is the most likely place to find them. I've used the Coast Guard's website to track down photos of odd items, but be prepared to look through hundreds if not thousands of images...




SJHussar@aol.com

I suggest that you contact my friend norman Brouwer at the South Street Seaport Museum.

Telephone (212) 748-8648. He has been researching the Brooklyn Navy yard for years. Perhaps he has a lead on where the kind of photos you need are to be had. National Archives branch is now out in New Jersy someplace.

ted_miles@nps.gov

Try the US Naval Institute: http://www.usni.org/hrp/hrp.html

Here's what they say: The U.S. Naval Institute has one of the world's largest private collections of U.S. Navy ships and aircraft. Approximately half the holdings are in this subject area. In addition to U.S. Navy ships and aircraft, the collection also houses images from the U.S. Coast Guard, Marine Corps, Army, and Air Force, as well as foreign militaries. The images are of ships, aircraft, weapons, personalities, combat, operations, equipment, and personnel. The collection is arranged by subject. Most of the collection is in black and white with color available after the mid 1960s. No published catalog exists at this time.

The USN itself has a photographic section: http://www.history.navy.mil/branches/nhcorg11.htm

The Naval Historical Center's Photographic Section has extensive pictorial reference files on all aspects of naval history. Its own collections are the principal source of photographs and other illustrations of U.S. Navy subjects made prior to 1920, and contain a wide selection of unique photography from later years. It also holds thousands of references to naval photographs held by other repositories.

Location: Washington Navy Yard, second floor of Building 108

Hours: Monday through Friday: 0900 - 1600 (9 a.m. - 4 p.m.)
CLOSED: Weekends and Federal holidays

Phone: (202) 433-2765; DSN 288-2765



Electric City Trolley Museum Association

> Dear Chris in approx. 1960 I went to bedt
> and took some pix. I think they were 35mm.
> If this will do I will try to find them. btw
> the new locos built for bedt had 1 3/4"
> tubes for burning hard coal. The used one
> have the more popular 2" size. Which
> does yours have? regards bb

BB and Chris,

The BNY 12 at the R&GV RR Museum has 134 two inch tubes. (I climbed in, and fed each one out through the flue sheets). The Conrad book shows it being sold to the Dexter & Northern in 1947, implying that it was at BNY up until that time.

Also, perhaps of interest, the Illinois Rwy Museum has a similar BNY saddletanker. I seem to recall that the number was 11, but I'm not certain. It was also a Vulcan, I believe.

Regards,

John R.


reddenej@aol.com

I must say the only thing that inside the Brooklyn Navy Yard today Railroad wise is very few track, a yard or two and the car float landing areas that is all. I am trying to find pictures that I have but I have seamed to have misplaced them but I will go there this week to take new ones. Also the only rail equipment that i know of is the Brooklyn Trolly I know it is mispelled this happens when you worked out in the sun all day at a railroad museum anyway there are PCC Cars there

http://RMLI.org
BEDT15@aol.com

Jim: I hope that BEDT #12 is headed towards a return to service! Of course you know that it was saved from scrap through the efforts of Ron Ziel, while he was writing his classic book, "The Twilight of Steam Locomotives". The funny thing was how he came to pay for it. Ron was newly discharged from the Army and discovered the treasure trove of little locomotives in their final months of service in Brooklyn. He photographed most of the fleet in operation, and sadly, a few which were condemned and cut up right where they stood. Desperate not to see #12 destroyed, he applied to his bank for an auto loan. While making out the documents, the details of the vehicle's weight, age, fuel, etc., began to emerge. The lending officer immediatly told Ron, "You can't buy a steam locomotive with this loan! For this you'll need a personal loan!", and helped Ziel get the cash he needed to save the little Porter. She sat in Jersey for a long time before Ron sold her to take part in the purchase of Royal Hudson, #2839, along with a number of other steam photographer luminaries.
Ron's writing partner, the late George H. Foster, pitched in to purchase BEDT #16, which has since changed hands and is preserved at the RMLI, in Riverhead, N.Y.
Get in touch with Ron Ziel for some wonderful photos in color and b&w or these sturdy little tank locos operating in the 60's, with the Manhatten skyline behind them.


glueck@maine.edu