Dave Dewey hits the nail on the head. Do as he says. Ain't complicated.

Ross Rowland

I am confident that EBT can be self-supporting by generating its own revenue, and confident that the three founders will accomplish that goal.

Given the success all 3 of the owners have had and their track record, I have little doubt they’ll be able to be self supporting in the future. But, it’s not going to be a cakewalk. Upkeep costs for the EBT are going to be much higher than your typical tourist line. And there is certainly a lot on that railroad to fix up.

It’s going to be a challenge, but one I’m willing to support all the way.

Oh, but Ross! - Where's the fun it that?


This time with all sincerity, I wish them the best in this endeavor!............mld

Why do you say that?


And there is certainly a lot on that railroad to fix up.

Agreed.

That’s mainly due to the age of the buildings, equipment, and track. Because (mostly) everything there is historic, it takes more money to restore it to good condition, or keep it in good condition. While most lines can boast of having a few more modern facilities to house rolling stock, that’s not the case for the EBT. There is a price to pay for history here.

I guess the closest direct comparison in age and historic preservation would be the Knight Foundry in California?

The EBT is now non-profit, and can use the "Butts in the Seats" over actual profits to its advantage for funding, particularly with a strong management team in place.

What has held back so many from stepping up to offer funds is the fact the EBT was a privately held company. That has now changed and I'm sure the current management is aware that they have now opened up the doors to funding that would have otherwise never materialized had it remained in private ownership. State control was never a good option, private ownership wasn't either. What exists now is what they have needed for decades.

It's a historic treasure, EBT is "fresh off the boat" from private ownership, it has been left unchanged for over 64 years, so it's as if time travel has happened and it is April 15, 1956 (the day after it ceased operations) all over again, but with a much better focus on preservation than existed back then.

This only works as long as you use Amtrak-style accounting methods:

Balance operating costs against operating income, while blissfully ignoring capital and infrastructure costs as being covered by "magical unicorn dust" or something.....

I don't know why it bugs me that folks here insist on continuing to post their thoughts on how the new EBT can survive. Keeping a non-profit large interpretive museum alive is a complex deal, and few know how to "do it." and fewer know the intricate ins and outs of such a financial world. BUT, the folks that banded together to create this foundation DO, and have proven track records of doing it.
So cut out all this speculation and just get behind the folks who brokered this deal. It has taken a long time to get to this point, a point many were afraid would never happen. Right now the future of the EBT has never been more positive. YES, there is a long row to hoe ahead, but I have faith that it can be done. Doom and gloom statements are not helpful right now, so please CUT IT OUT!!
Thank you for your time, and no, I have no connection with the EBT folks. Wish I were younger and didn't own so much "Stuff" because I think I would be very tempted to move back there just to be a worker on the EBT. I mentioned this to my wife, and the look I got is unprintable here.

That’s mainly due to the age of the buildings, equipment, and track. Because (mostly) everything there is historic, it takes more money to restore it to good condition, or keep it in good condition. While most lines can boast of having a few more modern facilities to house rolling stock, that’s not the case for the EBT. There is a price to pay for history here.[/quote]



Years ago things were built to last. Proof is that all the old structures are still standing. Crap built in recent years won't last. So, no it won't cost more. In fact without bureaucratic involvement it will be cheaper!

Note that the first priority the new folks have identified is a fire suppression system. Proof they have their priorities in order of importance!

A LOT of good things have taken place at EBT since the sale announcement. Locomotives are being inspected. A new concrete floor is being poured in one of the roundhouse stalls. Equipment is being moved around. Check out this link below:

https://www.facebook.com/ebtrr/

No. No, they're not.

Saltillo station deteriorated beyond hope and was demolished. The Saltillo water tank burned down.
The Robertsdale engine house is gone.
The Mt. Union yard office and several other structures up there are gone.
And, honestly, the only reason several structures in Orbisonia/Rockhill still stand is because both the FEBT and the railroad's owners undertook emergency-degree stabilization and rehab work--replacing windows, new/repaired roofs, replacing rotten foundation posts, etc. Otherwise, we'd have a few buildings fallen down to the ground by now. We must be grateful to both parties, otherwise we MIGHT not have very much left to save!

Over the years, as I traveled to and from the EBT (from both the northeast and southeast), I used to use as landmarks various structures of similar age along the roads and tracks of other railroad lines. Buildings like vintage barns, mills, or houses. On one route, a quick spot check via Google Earth found four of the five such buildings I remember off the top of my head gone now. One day now, it'll be the barn at Runk Road and 522, which even used to have an EBT billboard.

Most of the Orbisonia structures have had new roofs, or at least a new layer of roof paint, on them.

I've worked on historic houses in historic neighborhoods. It's FAR harder to do work on such houses while maintaining any degree of historic integrity. Take, as an example, a building that has old, out-of-date, deteriorating electric wiring or plumbing. (Imagine, say, the EBT depot, or the old farmhouse office across the street.) You don't just run conduit and new wiring and then stick drywall over it. (Oh, you CAN, but.....)

A friend of mine had a historic house with original slate roofing. After nearly a hundred years, too many slates were falling off. The estimate for in-kind replacement was $38,000 versus a regular roofing job of $8,000. He compromised with a lookalike version of fake slate, about $15,000.

I'll be the first to pile contempt and scorn on cheaply-built "McMansions." But we already have an "affordable housing crisis" in this nation, thanks to politics we won't get into here. The "old ways" are a relic of such things as clear-cut logging, cheap labor, building your own structures, and the like. We don't still use "slate-picking boys" in the breaker houses, or steam locomotives, either.

I've never been to that area. The nearest I've gotten is Altoona.

How would you characterize the general area, as a place to visit?

My wife and I like to go places and just roam around and see old things that have character, and I don't mean just railroad-related. If the natural terrain is interesting, and there are lots of remnants of the past, we're happy. We don't need gourmet restaurants, amusement parks, and lots of certified tourist attractions. We like atmosphere. Mood. We're not into crowds. We like peace and quiet, although if that's sometimes interrupted by the sound of trains, that's a plus! We like a slow pace.

Just looking at the map, I imagine we'd like that area a lot. However I know from experience that some places we've assumed would have a certain weathered charm instead have lots of just tacky schlock, and not much left of the past.

What's the area around the EBT like?

I sort of envision a trip from Maine (where we live) by train to Altoona, then renting a car to drive down and spend a few days roaming around, and seeing the railroad. Probably not this summer, though. We'll wait until this virus has for sure died down, and also give the EBT's new owners more time to get things up and going.

You would probably enjoy it--with a caution and caveat.

The problem with perhaps the vast majority of folks today is this (and I will freely admit to engaging in broad-brush stereotyping here):

They want to wander about quaint old houses, ride the "time capsule" steam train and trolleys, and go "back to nature"--but they also want squeaky-clean restrooms with ADA compliance and touchless toilets/sinks/hand dryers. They want a cell-phone signal everywhere, if not on-board wi-fi. And, too often, they want a motel with a pool nearby, and restaurant franchises they've heard of and have coupons for.

Lots of "city slickers" will be put off that all Orby has to offer is a tiny pizza parlor, the ice cream shack north of town, and now an A&W outlet in the newer "shopping center." And that, during Fall Spectacular Weekend, the locals set up a food stand at the station. As an example: My wife is a vegetarian. It's either the pizza, or fries for her. Anything the least bit better? Mt. Union maybe, or Huntingdon. (How big is the Sheetz in Mt. Union by now?)

Yes, I know, Cass, Kinzua, and some other places are worse in that regard. I grew up in central Pennsylvania and did a LOT of long-distance bicycling there. It's what I know. Teaberry ice cream, scrapple, Middleswarth potato chips, and volunteer fire department chicken BBQs.

Another issue that rears its head is that this is not some tourist attraction setting, but a way of life for a great many people. Profiting off of "tourism" means, in many cases, that people are often coming to gawk at you and the way you live, and not necessarily in a good way. That tends to build resentment. The nearby "Penna. Dutch Amish Country" has been all but destroyed by this factor. I wouldn't be surprised if Ohio's Amish country is next. And with our current divisive political climate pitting urbanites against "deplorables," I don't foresee this state of affairs improving.

Part of the long-range plan, not just for the EBT and Orby but the entire region including Raystown Lake, Altoona, Bedford, etc. has to be making the area not only visitor-friendly, but conducive to tourists of the 21st century--but doing so in a way that preserves the rural charm and doesn't turn the EBT or Curve into the proverbial "tourist trap."

And they're hardly the only ones in this situation, either.

You and your wife would most likely be amazingly happy exploring the EBT and the surrounding countryside. But the question for decades now has been, are there enough of you?

(And some of you are salivating for those potato chips right now, aren't you?)