The link will take you to an update on the recently completed cosmetic restoration of our Illinois Terminal Class C electric loco and the regular use of our trolley loop. Also see the recently restored 1930 Fifth Avenue double-deck bus. I hope to have recent shots of the progress on the Aerotrain up soon so stay tuned.

Museum of Transportation Projects
rdgoldfede@aol.com

Ron:

Wondering you could point me too a picture of this GS-6. I don't think I have ever seen a picture of it at St. Louis. Any idea how it came to be in St. Louis? I don't have an issue with the whys at all, just curious!

Thanks for any help and the continued updates, hope to visit the MOT sooner then later!

Joshua

joshua@joshuakblay.com

Joshua... Try www.steamlocomotive.info and search under 4460. There is a picture of the locomotive on there, but I couldn't get the link to work. Hope this helps.

drotarinoh@webtv.net

It sure does Bill. Thanks! I didn't realize MOT had a CN engine as well.

I'm still interested to know the hows and whys 4460 came to MOT.

Looking through the website Bill suggested only fans my desire to visit!

Joshua

joshua@joshuakblay.com

> I'm still interested to know the hows and
> whys 4460 came to MOT.

I hope someone will correct me if I'm wrong and fill in the details, but I believe 4460 like most other stuff at MOT was donated directly by the owning railroad. MOT's founder and longtime prime mover (Dr. ..... um, someone; I'm afraid I've forgotten the name) must have had a gift for persuasion. Throughout the 1950s he and his cohorts asked railroads to donate significant artifacts to their nacesent national collection, and more often than not, the railroads obliged. The good Dr. had a real connaisseur's eye for locomotives of national historic, aesthetic, or technological significance--hence the astounding quality of the present collection.

A lot of his success was having a place to put the stuff, and a fabulous sense of timing--the Dr. and his friends early on got title to a site to take their newly-acquired engines to, and they had the foresight and gumption to just go ahead and ask at a time when railroads were starting to seriously consolidate, streamline, and generally shake off old infrastructure and equiptment (and employees for that matter). After a while success in collecting fed on itself--the St. Louis folks had what was fast becoming a great collection, and what railroad officer didn't want his road's artifact donation to take a place beside the best?



eledbetter@rypn.org

Here is a brief version of our history. MOT built its collection under the leadership of Dr. John Payne Roberts, a physician at the Missouri Pacific Hospital, and a band of like-minded people. Starting in 1944 to save a mule-drawn streetcar from the local Public Service Company, they formed a non-profit organization, found a site, and began to collect artifacts. The first items came from the MP, which provided the rail connection to the outside world. The first locomotive, C&NW 4-4-2 #1015, was purchased at scrap value, but nearly all others were directly donated by the railroads after being asked to do so. As a member of the industry, Dr. Roberts attended all the meetings of RR Superintendents, Master Mechanics, etc and "worked the room" to help keep the collection growing. He and his associates were interested in collecting examples of each wheel arrangement, typical of locomotive practice, from the entire nation. Remember that there was no other museum collecting steam at this time. The B&O Museum opened in 1953, and already had most of its collection, and only added items from related lines like the Jersey Central. The Henry Ford Museum had locomotives, but this was only a small part of what they did. Travel Town in LA was also set up at this time, only collecting from its local area. Other rail related museums came along but MOT was there as steam went to scrap and tried to save representative examples. It was helped by a committee of rail executives, headed by Arthur K. Atkinson, president of the Wabash, who could and did write to the presidents of various lines to ask for donations. He also nagged them tirelessly on the phone until they agreed. This got MOT the only modern steam loco donated by the NYC and the first one by the IC, among others. SP 4460 was just one of the locos that was asked for and was donated by the Southern Pacific Company. It is our example of the 4-8-4. All were shipped free under section 22 of the ICC regulations that allowed (but did not require) free shipment for charitable purposes, also a result of Dr. Roberts shmoozing rail executives and supervisors as a tireless ambassador of the museum. A band of volunteers, two of which are still working with us, raced to lay track to hold the locos as they came in, using old and light rail and materials donated by the St. Louis railroads. We still have excellent relations with all the local lines and regularly get modest donations of items about to be discarded, often at the suggestion of the workers involved who are familiar with us. This has resulted in MOT having 33 steam locos, the largest collection in North America and a balanced one of nearly every type. We are still looking for a 2-6-2 and any type of geared loco, by the way.

Museum of Transportation
rdgoldfede@aol.com

The doctor also arranged the donation of locomotives and cars from the collection held by Purdue University.

tr2manz@frontiernet.net

Correct. And the origin of the Purdue Collection goes back to the Chicago World's Fair, when Professor Goss of Purdue saw the relics exhibited there. He then tried to save some actual old locomotives so his students could see the way things were done and gathered several before he moved to the University of Illinois. Purdue kept them together through two World War scrap drives and gave them to MOT in about 1952. One item that had been part of the collection was the "Daniel Nason," the only surviving inside connected locomovtive (a 4-4-0). It had only been on loan and the New Haven took it back to be at the New York World's Fair of 1939-40. We were able to get it about 1981 and put the Purdue Collection back together. So in some ways the start of our collection dates back to 1893.

Museum of Transportation
rdgoldfede@aol.com

Ron:

When you said only surviving inside connected locomotive, did you mean in the US? There are many inside connected engines that survive in the UK including 4-4-0s, 4-2-0s, and a 4-6-0 (only one of this type I'm afraid).

Joshua

joshua@joshuakblay.com

Sorry, I should have said in North America. The other Purdue locos are a C&NW Baldwin double steam dome 4-4-0, B&O "Camel" 4-6-0, and a Boston & Albany "Eddy Clock" 4-4-0 (no tender) from the 1870s. There is also a Boston & Providence passenger coach from 1832 built like a concord coach on railroad wheels, but it is too fragile to be placed outdoors and is in storage. This is the oldest original passenger car preserved.


Museum of Transportation
rdgoldfede@aol.com

Supposedly the Santa Fe 2-10-4 donation was sort of by accident. Santa Fe had refused to donate over the years as they never made it into St. Louis, despite many tries into the mid 1900's.

Then UP gave MOT a Big Boy. My source told me that literally one day the Santa Fe traffic manager in St. Louis called and informed the museum an engine was enroute from Waynoka, OK and that was their first notice.

jimhollis612@charter.net

When your museum is over 50 years old the stories build up, and many are true, so it sure is possible. In any case the Santa Fe gift wrapped that loco and it came with a big bow on it. We have the photos. Of course some other lines represented here also never got to St. Louis, but the collecting theory was that MOT was to be a national repository of transportation relics. The N&W comes to mind, also DM&IR, a vanderbilt tender from the GN, etc. There are also the stories of the ones that got away or were turned down that would make you weep. One was for a Milwaukee Road Class A 4-4-2, rejected as "not typical" and of course the C&NW 4-4-2 was already in place, space was short, etc, but . . . damn.

rdgoldfede@aol.com

> There are also the stories
> of the ones that got away or were turned
> down that would make you weep. One was for a
> Milwaukee Road Class A 4-4-2, rejected as
> "not typical"...

This is the first time I heard that any of the Milwaukee's streamlined steam was offered to anyone. Can you give any further details?

tr2manz@frontiernet.net

> The link will take you to an update on the
> recently completed cosmetic restoration of
> our Illinois Terminal Class C electric loco
> and the regular use of our trolley loop.
> Also see the recently restored 1930 Fifth
> Avenue double-deck bus. I hope to have
> recent shots of the progress on the
> Aerotrain up soon so stay tuned.

OK, Ron, so when are you putting it on a truck and bringing it up to run with our Class B for a couple of weeks? We'll stretch her legs for you!


Kevinmccabe@avenew.com