On top of that, the cylinders were rotary cam poppet valve type, and the engine had never performed properly when it was in service. The restoration replicated the two outside cylinders, poppet valves, rotary cams and drive, and rods. Mistakes in the fabrication/design of the ashpan and brick arch were discovered and corrected, and the dual stack exhaust which was noted to be undersized compared to similarly sized engines was replaced by a properly sized dual Kylchap. Since the original restoration, they've replaced the cams with new ones of an improved profile (suggested by Chapelon when the engine was in service) and they've done other upgrades as well.

The engine is now capable of far better performance than it was when new!

When does it cease being a basket base and just become a replica or a recreation?

Brother S.O.

Amen and Amen!

Wesley

I would add to this list, Wilmington & Western's ex PRR Gas Car #4662.

While it has undergone a second restoration, the intial one took several years and many many volunteer hours to get the car in running condition.

It was acquired as a shell in 1968(?) and returned to service in 1980, undergoing a second restoration in the 1990's and still in top notch condition today.

Also a potential add; their ex Lehigh Valley SW1 #114. It took a good bit of time and effort to get it into serivce as well....including the replacement of one truck among many other time consuming tasks.

I saw #75 a few years ago at Train Fest in Dennison. Beautiful engine and a blast to watch.

Before being restored to service Reading 2100 was the worst looking big engine I have ever seen. From what I understand she must have had a better than average boiler under all the rust. Everything else required complete rebuilding including parts donated by sister 2101.

John Bohon

les,

I am sure you are right. But I figured everybody here pretty well knows about the teriffic that the guys at the Brooklyn roundhouse did on the locomotive.

It sounds like the Sumpter Valley folks are going to do the ultimate basket case restoration of a Sumpter valley articulated. That is re-create a complete long gone locomotive.

time will tell!

Ted -

This is a surprise to me. Is this info on their website?

Les

The existance or non-existance of rust - at least the surface variety - has so very little to do with defining a locomotive project as a basket case. K4s #1361 had very little visible rust on her when she went into the shop the first time but most who have toiled on her for parts of the last 2 decades would most certainly call her a basket case. Just a partial list of what was done details the extent of the work on her.

New smokebox, new stack, new steam delivery pipes, new front and rear flue sheet, new dry pipe, naturally all new flues/tubes, new side sheets, fire box sheets, door sheet, backhead, entirely new mudring, at least one new axle, new eccentric rods, new superheater units, rebuilt driving boxes, rebuilt throttle, new washouts, rebuilt springs, rebuilt power reverser, all sorts of other rebuilt "accessories", all new wheels for the pony truck, thousands of stays/rivets/bushings, nevermind the entirely new jacketing, piping, valves, etc that have yet to be put back on - and we havent even talked about the tender yet.

The tender received a new floor, new roof, new slope sheets, new interior bracing, new side sheets 4' up both sides, one new tool box, new stoker trough, new rear step, new brake piping, and the frame had a 3" "dip" taken out of her.

She may have looked half-decent when she was pullled off the display at Horseshoe Curve but we all know how dangerous it is to judge a book by the cover.

This post will inevitably cause someone to build on the earlier comment about "replica/recreation". We have been asked many times about how much of the "original fabric" of the locomotive will be left. I hate to break the news to everyone but most of the original fabric was removed over the years by the Pennsy doing regular maintenance on 1361. Even the cylinders that are on the locomotive now are stamped with the identifying markings of another K4. The same is true of her running/valve gear. A myriad of numbers are stamped into those parts. You can't put over a million operating miles on a locomotive such as 1361 and still expect even the version retired to a Museum at the end of her useful life to contain much "original" fabric.

Thank you TJ for the kind comments. I would post pictures of both engines that show what they looked like but I am in Florida and dont have them on my laptop.

John

les,

no not on the web site but plunty of unofficial discussion about the subject on the Narrow gauge Discussion Forum.

Sure would be a treat to see such a project.

Ted miles